26 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

What consitutes a better year for you... is it simply sacks?   Like if Cox gets first team all pro... but Hargrave has one more sack... who has the better year?   But I like the idea of it even being considered.  Wow... can you imagine a team having to game plan for Hargraves like they do Cox.   They only have 3 interior blockers, can't double both!   The more they could double Hargraves would be so huge for us.   

Joe. are you aware that Cox was not in the top ten Tackles of the league last year for being double teamed? Unless you are constantly watching the man every snap most of the game most fans wouldn't be aware of how often he has to fight through a double team to get a QB hurry or sack. All I'm saying is that Cox isn't double teamed as much as the fans like to believe he is. Maybe at one time. But not now!

1. Aaron Donald  LA

2. DaQuan Jones TEN

3. Malcom Brown  NO

4. Grover Stewart IND

5. Dalvin Tomlinson NYG

6. A'Shawn Robinson  DET

7. Adam Butler   NE

8. Dre'Mont Jones  DEN

9. Chris Jones  KC

10. Romeo Okwara  DET

1 hour ago, joemas6 said:

 

Right ... but hey .... lets keep pushing the fight for the last spot... further and further down... one more seed and we are at hockey and basketball levels. 

Nothing but a good thing. Just adding one extra playoff game by making the two seed actually play a playoff game. Have one lesser team in the playoffs or have a bye with no game? I’ll take the game all day long.

2 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Yeah he's a deep guy specialist.Doesn't block or like to,so on those plays we will need a blocker on his side or tee off time on Wentz

Joe LOL,yeah I can see it now,no playoffs,but BRACKETS HAHA(ugh)

When you defend a speed guy. You Play well off or are turning and running your butt off. Either way you shouldn’t be very involved in shutting down a running play from outside.

Throw the sacks out the window between Cox and Hargraves. Last year Cox played 79 percent of the snaps or 814 snaps.  Hargraves played 62 percent of the snaps for the Steelers or 680 snaps. Cox had 26 tackles and 14 assists. Hargraves had 35 tackles and 25 assists playing less time. Both played all 16 games. Cox had 10 hurries and Hargraves had 6. Cox had 10 QB hits and Hargraves had 8. Cox had 21 pressures and Hargraves had 14. Lets not forget now that Hargraves played 62 percent of the snaps and Cox played 79 percent of the snaps. Hargraves was on a line with two other players going up against 5 O-linemen. Cox was on a line with 3 other linemen going up against 5 O-linemen. Not trying to shoot Cox down but he will be 30 and that is what I am basing my hunch on that Hargraves will have a better year than Cox.

18 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Nothing but a good thing. Just adding one extra playoff game by making the two seed actually play a playoff game. Have one lesser team in the playoffs or have a bye with no game? I’ll take the game all day long.

We need to go to 32 playoff teams... would be awesome.. .no byes... 16 playoff games wildcard weekend would be great!   

15 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Nothing but a good thing. Just adding one extra playoff game by making the two seed actually play a playoff game. Have one lesser team in the playoffs or have a bye with no game? I’ll take the game all day long.

Apparently the owners agree with you but I will bet the fans won't if that one extra playoff team has an 8 - 8 record.

2 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

I was hoping our first WR pick to be well rounded in all game phases,but Reagor is a speed only guy,so we need to plan around that.maybe Wentz rolls out on those plays where reagors side is vulnerable or Goedert covers the blocking over there on that play

What WR is well rounded in all game phases? Especially straight out of college. And why would he last until 21? No idea what the rest of this even means. Why is Wentz rolling out because he’s vulnerable to his outside WR not blocking? The outside WR goes out in a route. Takes the defenders with him. If the outside corner blitzes...there is never really a blocker for that guy. But somebody is open. QB has to hit them with the pass.

7 minutes ago, 1wrangler said:

Throw the sacks out the window between Cox and Hargraves. Last year Cox played 79 percent of the snaps or 814 snaps.  Hargraves played 62 percent of the snaps for the Steelers or 680 snaps. Cox had 26 tackles and 14 assists. Hargraves had 35 tackles and 25 assists playing less time. Both played all 16 games. Cox had 10 hurries and Hargraves had 6. Cox had 10 QB hits and Hargraves had 8. Cox had 21 pressures and Hargraves had 14. Lets not forget now that Hargraves played 62 percent of the snaps and Cox played 79 percent of the snaps. Hargraves was on a line with two other players going up against 5 O-linemen. Cox was on a line with 3 other linemen going up against 5 O-linemen. Not trying to shoot Cox down but he will be 30 and that is what I am basing my hunch on that Hargraves will have a better year than Cox.

You are right ... Watt is a LB ... and doesn't count as help for Hargraves.

All I can say.... keep looking at stats... keep looking at it as Cox played more and so he should get more snaps.  I look at it as when you can come off the field for rest, that you are better in those other snaps.  It's why I want to get Cox off the field.   teams go away from him, they focus their blocking on him.   I'm ok if you choose not to acknowledge how good he is... dude was double teamed... injured and the focus of the opponent.  Playing next to a no name group of DTs excdept for the injured Jernigan at the end.   Hargraves coming in makes the team better.   If he performs to the level where we actually have the 2 bet 4-3 DTs in football with Malik Jackson as #3.  I'm more than fine with that.   I like having stud DTs, first line of defense vs the run and closest position to the QB on the pass rush.   To me its game changing to have the talent there.  It's an underrated move IMO and yet people think Dallas is going to win the division because they drafted rookies to take the place of all the guys they lost.   I'm good with getting the DT and CB situations improved... and some speed on the outside at WR.  The rest is all tinsel on the tree for me.  

45 minutes ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Welp here we go again.Which of the 4 QB's had this accuracy rating?

yeah consistent QB play always helps

GB, seems you still aren't getting it.  You are looking at a particular QB.   This is about the WR.   X amount of passes were thrown to these particular WRs on this list.... who threw them the ball doesn't matter.... it was the percentage of accurate throws made to these WRs.   So it was all the throws made by EVERY QB to these WRs.   Reager had 31% of those throws made by all the TCU QBs that were accurate..... Jefferson had 69% of balls thrown to him by ALL LSU QBs that were accurate.     That is the chart.  

100 passes thrown to Jefferson ... 69 were on target .... the throw by the QB  (may or may not have been all Burrow?  Who cares?... it isn't a stat linked to a particular QB)    ...100 passes thrown to Reager... 31 were on target .... (doesn't say who, because it doesn't matter)

If Tom Brady throws a bad pass... its a bad pass.... if Sudfeld throws an accurate ball , then its an accurate pass.    This is the point.  you follow?????    

Some of these could even be trick plays from RBs or other WRs... we don't know... again, because it doesn't matter the who.  It's about the throws, not the thrower... the pass, not the passer.  

26 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

When you defend a speed guy. You Play well off or are turning and running your butt off. Either way you shouldn’t be very involved in shutting down a running play from outside.

If he's a starting WR he may have to depending on the play? Pulling him out is a sure sign of the upcoming play? Fools noone?

1 minute ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

If he's a starting WR he may have to depending on the play? Pulling him out is a sure sign of the upcoming play? Fools noone?

I don't see it that way... dude runs a fly pattern, good chance he comes off the field for a rest.   Do I think it telegraphs a run?   Not really?  They can still pass to other WRs.  

1 hour ago, 1wrangler said:

I can see this kid sitting it out for a year on the practice squad while the coaches put another 10 to 15 pounds of muscle on his frame. Of course he could return punts or kick offs but I don't want to see him get hurt right off the bat and create a hesitation in his running with abandonment mentality.

At best a redshirt year. This kid is way off from ready

7 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

GB, seems you still aren't getting it.  You are looking at a particular QB.   This is about the WR.   X amount of passes were thrown to these particular WRs on this list.... who threw them the ball doesn't matter.... it was the percentage of accurate throws made to these WRs.   So it was all the throws made by EVERY QB to these WRs.   Reager had 31% of those throws made by all the TCU QBs that were accurate..... Jefferson had 69% of balls thrown to him by ALL LSU QBs that were accurate.     That is the chart.  

100 passes thrown to Jefferson ... 69 were on target .... the throw by the QB  (may or may not have been all Burrow?  Who cares?... it isn't a stat linked to a particular QB)    ...100 passes thrown to Reager... 31 were on target .... (doesn't say who, because it doesn't matter)

If Tom Brady throws a bad pass... its a bad pass.... if Sudfeld throws an accurate ball , then its an accurate pass.    This is the point.  you follow?????    

Some of these could even be trick plays from RBs or other WRs... we don't know... again, because it doesn't matter the who.  It's about the throws, not the thrower... the pass, not the passer.  

Not facts,but an example.QB 1 plays 1 game 70% accuracy rating.he goes down Qb2 comes in-60% accuracy rating.he goes down after 1 game QB 3 comes in 50% accuracy rating. he goes down after 1 game QB 4 comes in and cant hit a bull in the a** with an arrow from 10 feet and plays the rest of the season,accuracy rating 20%. Yep the QB accuracy rating sucks because the majority of his target passes were thrown to him by QB 4.I'm done arguing this

Oh and BTW reagors drop rate is 13.9%.Did we draft another agholor?(those were on supposed accurate passes)

19 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

What WR is well rounded in all game phases? Especially straight out of college. And why would he last until 21? No idea what the rest of this even means. Why is Wentz rolling out because he’s vulnerable to his outside WR not blocking? The outside WR goes out in a route. Takes the defenders with him. If the outside corner blitzes...there is never really a blocker for that guy. But somebody is open. QB has to hit them with the pass.

Lamb .. he is polished apparently?   Not really big or fast ... but he is polished... probably make a great #2 WR for years.... yet everyone wanted to trade up for him?  He was a good college player.  Will it translate?  IDK.  Usually to be an elite WR you need either speed or size?  It's certainly not the whole game as there are details and work to be done to get open, YAC...etc.  But there are things you can learn.   To we want the polished guy with not much to grow, or the athlete than can learn and excel?   I'll take the athlete at this point in time with our current team.  There will be other times when I would prefer the polished guy.    That changes as the needs and style of the team changes.   We needed speed with our system and out current roster.  The polished guy doesn't help as much IMO.  Other than take away stats from similar players like Ertz, Goedert, Ward, JJAW....etc.   We need guys to be able to do other stuff.  Give Wentz the full arsenal of weapons.  

1 hour ago, joemas6 said:

My prediction at WR....  

DeSean, Whiteside, Ward, Reager, ... goodwin and the other 2 rookies... all 7 make the roster to start.  Goodwin might be out .. or one of them goes on IR.   The ST ability looks good this year.  Even like the UDFAs the CB from Baylor and the RB from UCF.   Expanded rosters ... my guess is teams will look to keep more of their own guys on the practice squads?  Maybe one of our WRs ends up there.  

This offseason could be a blessing.... you may see who decides to put the work in on their own!   good sign of what is important to them

Alshon would be eight 

1 minute ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Oh and BTW reagors drop rate is 13.9%.Did we draft another agholor?(those were on supposed accurate passes)

Yep.. .I will get you a link that I saw... it actually showed a video of the " drops"  it was pretty good context.   Dude made some nice catches though.  

But again... with your QBs... you can worry about the who all you want... bottom line... as the passes were thrown to Reager... 31% came in accurately.  So add all those QBs up however you like... basically 3 out of 10 passes were well thrown vs 7 out of 10 well thrown to Jefferson.  

1 minute ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Alshon would be eight 

alshon will not be here... pup, then trade or cut.  

2 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Alshon would be eight 

Listen to the press conferences ... funny how Doug and Howie both omitted Alshon when talking about needing a vet WR when trading for Goodwin?????   To me, very telling.  Not the BS from before.  

WE know they need cap space.  They will try to hang on as long as possible... but I doubt he ever sets footy at Novacare again.  

3 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

Yep.. .I will get you a link that I saw... it actually showed a video of the " drops"  it was pretty good context.   Dude made some nice catches though.  

But again... with your QBs... you can worry about the who all you want... bottom line... as the passes were thrown to Reager... 31% came in accurately.  So add all those QBs up however you like... basically 3 out of 10 passes were well thrown vs 7 out of 10 well thrown to Jefferson.  

alshon will not be here... pup, then trade or cut.  

None of this matter,it's how he does with Wentz now

1 hour ago, joemas6 said:

Ham, lets see what happens.  I don't think you are seeing it... so it needs to happen first.  

More playoff teams ... .means the fight will be for seed 7, not seed 6.  If 3 teams are fighting for the 6th seed and 3 teams fighting for the 7th seed, its the same except its the teams that aren't as good fighting for it.    

Again though... you are looking at week 14.   I hope EVERYONE still plays week 14.... i'm looking at 17 games and the last couple of weeks.  So what is that ... weeks 17 and 18 now right?  I sure hope with a month left everyone is still playing.   You are missing the fact that once teams get in and they can't move up, they will choose to rest guys.  It's nice in your head to work your way... but you know if an injury happens.  lets say it's Wentz week 18 in a game that can move us up from seed 4 to 3 or from guaranteed 6 or 7 to possible 5.   Doug will get killed and the following year no chance of that.   Once that injury happens for your noble fight for a #.   Things will change. 

We shall see.  It needs to happen first like Hockey and basketball for it to really show.  Football to me was special in that every game would normally mean something.  Not all the time, but this will create more meaningless ball the last week or 2, and I don't want that.  

IDK.. it's January ... do I want to see Wentz dive for the end zone so we can move up a slot?   Are you really into that as much as if it were for a bye or the division or just to get in?  WE gotta play Cox 60 snaps that last week to sell out to move up to #5 seed?   I'll pass.  

Somehow in your mind you just said that the fourth seed will rest their players. Being the fourth seed means that very likely you don’t even have your division wrapped up, right? So you have homegirls to play for. Heck the fourth seed might not make the playoffs without winning their division...like us last year.

ok new rules question.How will they work "home field" if 2 teams are tied including tie breakers?

42 minutes ago, 1wrangler said:

Throw the sacks out the window between Cox and Hargraves. Last year Cox played 79 percent of the snaps or 814 snaps.  Hargraves played 62 percent of the snaps for the Steelers or 680 snaps. Cox had 26 tackles and 14 assists. Hargraves had 35 tackles and 25 assists playing less time. Both played all 16 games. Cox had 10 hurries and Hargraves had 6. Cox had 10 QB hits and Hargraves had 8. Cox had 21 pressures and Hargraves had 14. Lets not forget now that Hargraves played 62 percent of the snaps and Cox played 79 percent of the snaps. Hargraves was on a line with two other players going up against 5 O-linemen. Cox was on a line with 3 other linemen going up against 5 O-linemen. Not trying to shoot Cox down but he will be 30 and that is what I am basing my hunch on that Hargraves will have a better year than Cox.

And the Steelers pass rush was unleashed by their pass rushers last year. Great Dline and OLB(they play a 3-4). Our Dline was a little down last year. The Steelers also traded their first round pick for Minkah last year. Had a good secondary. Allowed that extra second for the rushers. Our secondary was horrific. No QB feared just chucking it up against any of our secondary. Huge factors. Always have to notice when one pass rusher gets the other quality bookend. The whole line surges up in production. Also notice good secondaries work in a symbiotic relationship with the Dline. Secondary gives more time to the Dline. And the Dline forcing pressure helps the secondary get easy picks.

7 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Somehow in your mind you just said that the fourth seed will rest their players. Being the fourth seed means that very likely you don’t even have your division wrapped up, right? So you have homegirls to play for. Heck the fourth seed might not make the playoffs without winning their division...like us last year.

Ham... again.. I started by saying ... you fight for 3 things ... making the playoffs, division title and the bye.

Prior.... 6 teams....

2 Byes
2 Division winners with home games
2 playoff teams wildcard

Now

1 Bye to fight for ... means less teams fighting for it due to one less bye
2.  The division winners who already have it locked up ... but cant get a bye.... now this will only increase
3.  The 3rd wildcard team, means that you could see the 6th seed already locked in... 3 teams now means more could not have to fight to get in because they are in already.

I don't want to see more playoff teams rest guys.   There will always be the fights for division and last playoff spot.  This will be constant.  We now have created less involvement for a bye.  And more to where teams can relax and already be in.  

40 minutes ago, 1wrangler said:

Apparently the owners agree with you but I will bet the fans won't if that one extra playoff team has an 8 - 8 record.

What’s it matter? For one it’s already happened under the old format. But fans will hate the extra playoff game because the bottom seed doesn’t have a winning record? Not buying that. Some people may ****. But fans still will be watching that playoff game. Worse case scenario it’s a blowout playoff game. So what move on. But sometimes it will provide a good playoff game.

   The kicker for me is it doesn’t allow this Patriot bull crap. They got a free bye every year because of division and schedule. What happened when they blew the last game of the season to the a Dolphins? They didn’t get a bye. And they lost. We shouldn’t want teams coasting yo a free bye week in the playoffs getting this huge advantage. Home field advantage should be enough. Pats were gifted too much. I want to see teams have to earn it. No more of this one win at home and your in the Conference Championship Gsme. All because you beat lowlifes twice a season.

Eagles won the division last year in game 16.   Tiebreaker could have had them not need the game week 18 (the new 17th game)  ... why would they play?  They couldn't move up to seed 3?

SF had their division won ... did Seattle need to play week 18?   

The Steelers and the Rams could have been 7 seeds.  Did Tennessee or Minnesota need to play the last week?  This is what I'm saying ... you add a game... and you add a playoff team.  Now I just showed you where multiple playoff teams would have had nothing to play for with that extra week and already being locked in.

But to you guys its worth it because it was possbile the 8-8 Bears could have tied the 9-7 Rams for the final spot....   and in the AFC ... the 8-8 Steelers could have been tied with one of these 7-9 teams for the last spot.... Jets, Colts, Broncos and Raiders?   

Wow... the excitement of watching those powerhouses duke it out week 18 ... while Philly, Seattle, Minnesota, Buffalo, Tennessee  ... all rested guys.   i'm so looking forward to it in the future.  But hey... maybe KC and NE go all out for the #2 seed????     At least we can make a case that Green Bay, SF and NO could have battled for a bye.... that was really unique to have 3 teams tied with the same record at the top.  would have been great to see one of those teams battle a 3 win Detroit team or a 5 win Arizona / Carolina team to get a bye.  The GB vs Detroit would have had huge ratings.   Not as much as a possible Jets vs Raiders game for that coveted 8-9 record as the final playoff seed.  Ratings threw the roof baby!!!!