8 minutes ago, mattwill said:

Ideally you are trading with one of the worst teams in the league, but one that has a specific target player in mind the way the Ravens had Jackson in mind when they did the Goedert trade.  In that trade the Eagles received a second-round pick (No. 52), a fourth-round pick (No. 125) and a 2019 second-round pick. so the alternative trade would become the Eagles receiving a second-round pick (No. 52), a fourth-round pick (No. 125) and a 2020 first-round pick.

I just don't see the value in a 2020 first rounder... 

4 minutes ago, UK Eagle said:

You'd think that firms would be smarter than that.  Hung Dong is very obviously a prank name.  What next? Ivor Biggun?

Suq Madiq

12 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Also understood, but trading with a team that knows what they are doing never works out as well as trading with a team that doesn't.  My trade offers roughly appropriate value on the chart.   #24 is ~740 points, #34 is ~ 560... and the 2024 1st would count as 2 rounds later...so middle of 3rd round is ~180.   That's 740 points each way, but the Eagles get to play the compound interest game by taking the pick in 2024.  Something tells me the Jags, Lions and Jets would still be top 5, at worst top 10 picks in 2024, no matter who they draft with this pick.

Agreed.  For grins I've taken a look at the past trade downs for Pick #22.  Here's one example.  it doesn't include a future year 2nd Round pick, but it does give an indication of the value of trading down 4 slots from #22.  

Eagles traded • 2014 first round pick (#22-Johnny Manziel) to Browns for • 2014 first round pick (#26-Marcus Smith) + 2014 third round pick (#83-Louis Nix III) on 2014-05-08

and here is another showing the value of trading down 8 slots from #22.  

Rams traded • 2013 first round pick (#22-Desmond Trufant) • 2015 seventh round pick (#249-Akeem King) to Falcons for • 2013 first round pick (#30-Alec Ogletree) • 2013 third round pick (#92-Stedman Bailey) • 2013 sixth round pick (#198-Chris Jones) on 2013-04-25

 

22 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

The myth is that a franchise QB alone makes a team competitive.  Teams need a top 10 performing defense in order to win.  It is just as important as a franchise QB.  The best defensive players are aging veterans that need to be replaced.  Even if you replace that talent, the team still lacks a real difference maker at any level.  

Wrong.

10 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

No it isn't. The difference in the modern NFL between a top 10 defense and a 16th ranked defense is very small. Defense is less and less relevant in the modern NFL.

Correct.

4 defenses give up less than 20 PPG, Patriots, Buffalo, Denver and New Orleans.  Only 1 of those teams has a legitimate shot at winning it all, the one with the franchise QB's.

Arizona is 5th, allowing 20.5 PPG, and the Bears at 20th allow 23.5 PPG.  As you stated, the difference between top 5 and 20 is minimal, a field goal.  I am pretty sure if Aaron Rodgers played for the Bears, he would overcome that 3 PPG more times than not.

Here are the super bowl teams listed in order of odds, and how they rank in PPG allowed.

Packers - 8th

Chiefs - 13th

Bills - 2nd

Rams - 15th

Cowboys - 7th

Titans - 6th

Patriots - 1st

Bengals - 18th

Why do the Bills, with the #2 scoring defense, have lower odds than the Packers and Chiefs ?? Could it be the difference in QB ??  Why do the Patriots, with the #1 scoring defense have lower odds than the Rams who are 15th ??  Could it be the difference in QB ??

 

14 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I'll wait a year for that impact.  We are likely waiting longer for the QB, so having the DE be 21 years old and on a bit of a slow learning curve just helps with keeping the draft resources a little stronger... and then maybe when they get the QB right, then the DE will make the leap forward.

Let me continue to talk myself out of him!  The Eagles have a habit of taking people i don't want!  Maybe I can trick them this year.  All jokes aside, I agree on all accounts.  If brought along properly I think the kid will be a monster.  

1 hour ago, greend said:

 

 

 

Okay so now I'm really confused. Why do I care if Minny and the browns trade quarterbacks?

You don’t, just a question, it’s not the end of the world, but it’s an interesting trade proposal IMO, that’s all.  
 Clearly I’m an idiot, no one disputes that, but apparently in more ways than I believed because if I’m the Browns, I don’t make that trade, but most fans disagree with me.  I don’t think much of Baker, or Kirk, but Baker still has some years left and he’s cheaper for at least one year. 

In other news.  

 

36 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Chris Boniol.

Chris T Jones

Good

1	Kansas City	51.83%
2	Tampa Bay	47.64%
3	LA Chargers	47.29%
4	Buffalo	46.57%
5	Arizona	44.83%
5	Philadelphia	44.83%

Good

 

 

Jalen Hurts

PHI

108

58

53.7

 

Oof

25 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

And btw, what secondaries don't elite QBs pick apart? They pick apart even the best secondaries. That's why getting that elite QB is so important. You have to outscore those elite QBs if you want to beat them. The Eagles have no shot at doing that with an offense that's horrible at throwing the football.

Yep, Josh Allen wrecked the Patriots #1 scoring defense two week ago.  Dak Prescott did the same.

2 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Wrong.

Correct.

4 defenses give up less than 20 PPG, Patriots, Buffalo, Denver and New Orleans.  Only 1 of those teams has a legitimate shot at winning it all, the one with the franchise QB's.

Arizona is 5th, allowing 20.5 PPG, and the Bears at 20th allow 23.5 PPG.  As you stated, the difference between top 5 and 20 is minimal, a field goal.  I am pretty sure if Aaron Rodgers played for the Bears, he would overcome that 3 PPG more times than not.

Here are the super bowl teams listed in order of odds, and how they rank in PPG allowed.

Packers - 8th

Chiefs - 13th

Bills - 2nd

Rams - 15th

Cowboys - 7th

Titans - 6th

Patriots - 1st

Bengals - 18th

Why do the Bills, with the #2 scoring defense, have lower odds than the Packers and Chiefs ?? Could it be the difference in QB ??  Why do the Patriots, with the #1 scoring defense have lower odds than the Rams who are 15th ??  Could it be the difference in QB ??

 

Denver is the perfect example of a team that actually has quite a bit of talent, but aren't relevant because they have no QB.

And the Bengals weren't relevant until they got Burrow.

You're nothing in this league without an elite QB.

39 minutes ago, mattwill said:

So, here's a follow-up question for everyone.  Who do you like more, Nakobe Dean or Devin Lloyd? And do you think the eagles will go contrary to historical drafting patterns and take one of those two in the 1st Round.

I like them both but Lloyd more, definitely.  Longer, just as fast. First round? Lloyd, maybe. Dean, no.

30 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

Dean.  Consistently higher level of competition.

True enough, but he's had those monsters in front of him to protect him. Lloyd did not. Nor did anyone else, for that matter. I think both Lloyd and Harris get picked before him.

3 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Denver is the perfect example of a team that actually has quite a bit of talent, but aren't relevant because they have no QB.

And the Bengals weren't relevant until they got Burrow.

You're nothing in this league without an elite QB.

It's amazing how few people even bring up Burrow had his ACL and MCL torn last season in Week 11.  He's had a remarkable season, all things considered.

5 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

Denver is the perfect example of a team that actually has quite a bit of talent, but aren't relevant because they have no QB.

Exactly.  9th in yards allowed, 3rd in points allowed.  They are 23rd in points scored, because the do not have a QB who can get the ball to their playmakers.

1 minute ago, downundermike said:

Exactly.  9th in yards allowed, 3rd in points allowed.  They are 23rd in points scored, because the do not have a QB who can get the ball to their playmakers.

Don't you disrespect Teddy 2 Gloves!

2 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

It's amazing how few people even bring up Burrow had his ACL and MCL torn last season in Week 11.  He's had a remarkable season, all things considered.

Nah, he's inconsistent. Needs to show he can be a QB.

That's what @austinfan has said, anyway.

Adding to my previous @NCiggles, I showed you teams outside of the top 10 in points allowed are tops in super bowl odds.  Continuing to prove that this is an offensive league, if the Chargers get in, the top 13 teams in PPG are all in the playoffs, and the Titans at 15.  You do not need an elite defense as much as you need a QB and be able to score.

4 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Nah, he's inconsistent. Needs to show he can be a QB.

That's what @austinfan has said, anyway.

5th in yards, #1 in completion percentage, 4th in TD passes, 11th in QBR, 2nd in QB rating.  Obviously he sucks.

Just now, downundermike said:

5th in yards, #1 in completion percentage, 4th in TD passes, 11th in QBR, 2nd in QB rating.  Obviously he sucks.

Scrub.

2 minutes ago, downundermike said:

5th in yards, #1 in completion percentage, 4th in TD passes, 11th in QBR, 2nd in QB rating.  Obviously he sucks.

He's not proven...

Here are some historical trades for #18 ... the first one moving down to #31, which is one of the two Super Bowl teams and doesn't fit Iggles_Phan's "bad team" criteria ... the second one again is with one of the Playoffs teams ...

Cowboys traded • 2013 first round pick (#18-Eric Reid) to 49ers for • 2013 first round pick (#31-Travis Frederick) + 2013 third round pick (#74-Terrance Williams) on 2013-04-25

Seahawks traded • 2018 first round pick (#18-Jaire Alexander) +• 2018 seventh round pick (#248-Kendall Donnerson) to Packers for • 2018 first round pick (#27-Rashaad Penny) + 2018 third round pick (#76-Mason Rudolph) • 2018 sixth round pick (#186-Jacob Martin) on 2018-04-26

And Here are some historical trades for #14 ... the first example being a trade down of 9 slots picking up two current year 3rd round picks.  Transforming those into a better pick the following year, possibly even a 1st round pick is interesting to consider ...  the second one already has a future year 1st Rounder in it ... 

Vikings traded • 2021 first round pick (#14-Alijah Vera-Tucker) + 2021 fourth round pick (#143-Tyree Gillespie) to Jets for • 2021 first round pick (#23-Christian Darrisaw) + 2021 third round pick (#66-Kellen Mond) + 2021 third round pick (#86-Wyatt Davis) on 2021-04-29

Packers traded • 2018 first round pick (#14-Marcus Davenport) to Saints for • 2018 first round pick (#27-Rashaad Penny) + 2018 fifth round pick (#147-Micah Kiser) • 2019 first round pick (#30-Deandre Baker) on 2018-04-26

2 hours ago, Parrot Head said:

Well, those guys can state their positions if they want to, I just haven't seen it.

I have never once said that Hurts is a long term answer so I am being misrepresented...not that I really care what other's  opinions might be. I have been very outspoken that QB is currently a concern.

3 minutes ago, downundermike said:

5th in yards, #1 in completion percentage, 4th in TD passes, 11th in QBR, 2nd in QB rating.  Obviously he sucks.

And if the Bengals lose in the playoffs, you know the narrative will be "what has he won???”

Ive seen people use the "only one Super Bowl” thing from Hurts stans over the last few weeks, to denigrate Rodgers when trade possibilities come up in conversation. If Rodgers was an Eagle, somehow I think "only one Super Bowl” wouldn’t be the narrative and it would be that Rodgers is the best QB in the NFL and we’re lucky to have him.

31 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Also understood, but trading with a team that knows what they are doing never works out as well as trading with a team that doesn't.  My trade offers roughly appropriate value on the chart.   #24 is ~740 points, #34 is ~ 560... and the 2024 1st would count as 2 rounds later...so middle of 3rd round is ~180.   That's 740 points each way, but the Eagles get to play the compound interest game by taking the pick in 2024.  Something tells me the Jags, Lions and Jets would still be top 5, at worst top 10 picks in 2024, no matter who they draft with this pick.

Two rounds later?  I thought the formula was only one round. 

EDIT: you are taking the 1st in 2024 which is two years later rather than one year.  Is that correct?

Unrelated...

Rumor is Calvin Ridley will be on the move from Atlanta. Would you take him/what would you be willing to give up?