Agree and disagree... and this is my concern with a QB that runs as part of the offensive philosophy...  Highly effective for 4 years, then banged up.  Then a decent year, and then... washed.  

The idea that Hurts is 'built different' is the same thing we heard about Cam Newton.  He wasn't.  The hits built up and he was washed up by age 30.  That's not how it is supposed to work with the QB position.  The top guys can play at a top level at least into the mid-30s.  So, I want to see fewer and fewer and fewer designed QB runs for Hurts.  

 

and Happy B-day, Earl!

 

46 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

This was mild, if that.  Moderate tbi is much more severe than what we saw.  He wouldn’t be flying home with the team either.

A general picture of best case moderate TBI: at least 24hr of barely forming words, eyes only opening to loud screaming sounds right in the ear, and barely giving a thumbs up when someone shouts at you while grinding a fist in the chest.

How dare you disagree with my google searched opinions.  

Ah Christ I’ve to watch the eagles game on sky sports and not gamepass on Sunday. The uk posters will back me up on the "quality” of the sky sports nfl coverage.

28 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

Who has final say? Independent doctor or the team doctor?

Typically, it should be the team doctors, for their own protection.

However, in the scenario of a concussion where teams have tried to hide/cover up it is probably the independent doctor. 

 

Going through school, we were taught, the training staff and your team doctor have final say. No one else can clear an athlete to return if you know it is wrong. I have had to hold a wrestler with mono back, because his family doctor cleared him way too early. And most competent practitioners realize the danger of a lacerated liver in contact sports with mono.

In the case of a concussion, if a kid goes to their family doctor and gets cleared- they can only be cleared to begin my return to play protocol. Or if the doctor does something like arbitrarily say cleared to return to sports in 1 week- if the athlete is still symptomatic I can say no- thats good that your doctor cleared you, but I havent yet. You need to be symptom free to begin the return to play process.

These things can be real battles between myself against the athlete/parents/coaches who all got a note from the doctor saying the kid is ok to play. And here I am, not a doctor, saying I am overruling the doctor.... Not fun.

Why is it like that? Because I am liable, not the independent doctor. Maybe they can be held liable too. But that doesnt protect me. The medical staff is not obligated to jeopardize their careers because of some other doctors dangerous opinion. Doctors have a higher level of education than me, but many lack the specialized training in particular areas that I have.

In either of those scenarios, the kid ruptures his liver, or gets second impact syndrome the lawyers look at my training and say I know he was cleared by someone else, but YOU should have known better. Here is what you are taught in your education. Here is the protocol spelled out by the health organization you work for. You are employed by them, you should be following their guidelines. Here is the law that dictates the protocol in your state. These are all things that govern your actions and you did not follow the process the way it is written. 

 

Long story short- independent doctor likely clears to begin concussion return to play protocol. Team medical staff are the ones to bring the player through that and monitor for any setbacks. In charge of progressing the player through, or holding back to repeat steps as needed until they can work their way through everything with no recurrence of symptoms. Only then, can they be cleared to return to actual competition.

59 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

FYP

"I ain't got time to bleed." One of the best movie lines of all time.

27 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

The NFL is the Dolphins. 

The owner of the Dolphins is part owner of the NFL but the NFL does not have any ownership interest in the Dolphins.  They are distinct entities.  The NFL has a CEO and he is beholden to the owners to the extent they have enacted policies and to the extent some super majority agree on issue to change a policy.  

3 minutes ago, EaglesIreland said:

Ah Christ I’ve to watch the eagles game on sky sports and not gamepass on Sunday. The uk posters will back me up on the "quality” of the sky sports nfl coverage.

**** announcers sounds entertaining.  

3 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

"I ain't got time to bleed." One of the best movie lines of all time.

Between him and the Governator, some pretty great one-liners.

31 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

That's not quite how it works.

 

It is when the NFL already handed out a huge settlement in concussions and needs to protect their own ass. 

4 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

The owner of the Dolphins is part owner of the NFL but the NFL does not have any ownership interest in the Dolphins.  They are distinct entities.  The NFL has a CEO and he is beholden to the owners to the extent they have enacted policies and to the extent some super majority agree on issue to change a policy.  

**** announcers sounds entertaining.  

It’s not the announcers as we in Ireland get the game feed that all ye get. It’s the in studio people which I can’t stand.

47 minutes ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

The decision has to be taken out of their hands. Some of these guys will die on the field before being taken out and replaced. It's boxer/fighter mentality. You need a third party to make that decision. 

Along that line... Wentz got blasted by people for mentioning that he had symptoms on the sidelines of a playoff game.  The fans need to change their mentality as well.  These guys are not gladiators to fight to the death for our entertainment.  

42 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

It is when the NFL already handed out a huge settlement in concussions and needs to protect their own ass. 

Clearing the Dolphins if Tua is found to have sustained a concussion does nothing to protect them because if the Dolphins followed protocol despite there being a concussion, then there's a problem with the protocol's sufficiency or if they cleared them when they didn't follow protocol then the other 31 and NFL are creating liability for themselves by not enforcing the rules.  

4 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

Clearing the Dolphins if Tua is found to have sustained a concussion does nothing to protect them because if the Dolphins followed protocol despite their being a concussion, then there's a problem with the protocol's sufficiency or if they cleared them when they didn't follow protocol then the other 31 and NFL are creating liability for themselves by not enforcing the rules.  

 

You have a bit too much trust in large corporations. 

58 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

The decision is out of their hands.  However, how they report their symptoms, and if they have any symptoms, is always in their hands.  The team, the independent doctors, etc.  They are all using information provided by the patient.  

Guys got around the draft board restrictions years ago that were too blind to pass a physical, because they memorized the eye chart.  Motivated patients can (and do) lie about symptoms or lack of symptoms.  There's really no way to get around that that I know.   The patient will always be involved in the process.   And while, as it pertains to the NFL, the player doesn't have the final decision, their input informs those who do.  And, like it, hate it or whatever, it is their body and their risk... and their livelihood.  

Fair, but when a guy is clearly stumbling around and can't even stand without his teammates holding him up, that should be all they need to know right there. And spare me on the "It was a back injury!" talk like some in here keep saying. The guy never grabbed his back and he was out on his feet. 

@LeanMeanGM or proxy:

Eagles 19, Jaguars 17

Jake's swinging (his leg) in the rain.

8 minutes ago, BDawk_ASamuel said:

Fair, but when a guy is clearly stumbling around and can't even stand without his teammates holding him up, that should be all they need to know right there. And spare me on the "It was a back injury!" talk like some in here keep saying. The guy never grabbed his back and he was out on his feet. 

I don't disagree and am speaking in generalities.  I didn't see Tua's injury the week before.

2 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I don't disagree and am speaking in generalities.  I didn't see Tua's injury the week before.

 

4 minutes ago, Greenakers2 said:

@LeanMeanGM or proxy:

Eagles 19, Jaguars 17

Jake's swinging (his leg) in the rain.

@Connecticut Eagle

15 hours ago, HazletonEagle said:

Thank you!

I was thinking it looked a lot like decordicate flexion. But the clue was how quickly it went away.  Correct?

I have seen a lot of concussions but I have yet to see a fencing response, or worse (thankfully). How do you know the tone went away? Would he have been too rigid to position they way they had him on the spine board?

 

Something else, speaking of my experience- for the first time ever, this week, I had a kid with head to head impact that had facial numbness and tingling. This happened at an away event. I received a text, and email from the trainer there and the kid was kept out of the rest of the game. All symptoms were said to have resolved within an hour. I didnt see the kid till 2 days later in the training room.  I was concerned if he was going to present with some delayed onset palsy from an injury to his facial or trigeminal nerve and potential skull fracture. Thankfully everything appeared ok. 

That was just something a little different for me, and interesting, and stressful till I got to see him. 

I remembered you mentioning this

 

17 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Along that line... Wentz got blasted by people for mentioning that he had symptoms on the sidelines of a playoff game.  The fans need to change their mentality as well.  These guys are not gladiators to fight to the death for our entertainment.  

 

47 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

Agree and disagree... and this is my concern with a QB that runs as part of the offensive philosophy...  Highly effective for 4 years, then banged up.  Then a decent year, and then... washed.  

The idea that Hurts is 'built different' is the same thing we heard about Cam Newton.  He wasn't.  The hits built up and he was washed up by age 30.  That's not how it is supposed to work with the QB position.  The top guys can play at a top level at least into the mid-30s.  So, I want to see fewer and fewer and fewer designed QB runs for Hurts.  

 

and Happy B-day, Earl!

 

I think you are right about this and even prostestations about Hurts being able to protect himself and avoid hits ultimately doesn't work because hits cannot always be avoided.  I do think you have to weigh this against the team's success.  Players have a shelf life.  Certainly QBs can play longer than other positions but not every QB can remain elite into their 30's.  Cam Newton had 8 years as an above average QB that averaged over 100 rushing attempts per season.  If Cam had average 50 attempts, would he have been as productive as a QB? Maybe without the rushing ability he doesn't play for 8 seasons because he was pretty mediocre as a passer.  I think rushing more than 100 attempts in a season will put a wear and tear on Hurts.  He had more rushing attempts last season than Vick ever had in a season.  It tied the highest number of attempts for Cam.  It is less than Lamar Jackon has put up but I think his number of rushing attempts is really an outlier.  

There is unquestionably a value now to having Jalen do designed runs in addition to scrambles.  I do think it should be limited to high leverage situations where his rushing ability is more of a factor in the game.  

27 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

I don't disagree and am speaking in generalities.  I didn't see Tua's injury the week before.

 

My entire wife's family is at our house now because of this storm (3 additional kids, a MIL in a wheelchair, a BIL and 2 SIL).  Our house has been taken over, and I've locked myself inside my office at least until 5 pm.  I was complaining about it for awhile to one of the team members and he eventually sent me this, and I can't stop laughing.  

@EaglePhan1986 @mikemack8

https://overthecap.com/player/quinnen-williams/7794

2022 base salary of $965,000...

19 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

You have a bit too much trust in large corporations. 

Haha - no, I don't trust large corporations.  I just don't think there is some coordinated cover by the NFL.  I am sure there is implicit bias to clear these teams. I just don't think the NFL benefits by clearing the Dolphins.  I also believe the investigators were likely sincere in their investigations.  It doesn't mean they did a good job or were competent.  More to your point, the NFL does not avoid a lawsuit by clearing the Dolphins if Tua had a concussion on Sunday.  

1 hour ago, EaglesIreland said:

It’s not the announcers as we in Ireland get the game feed that all ye get. It’s the in studio people which I can’t stand.

Same problem here with our local channel that carries the NFL.  I always just watch on Game Pass even though I have the local feed.  Our guys sometimes dub over the game itself which I absolutely hate with a passion.  Haven't had to deal with that crap for years though.

3 minutes ago, hputenis said:

My entire wife's family is at our house now because of this storm (3 additional kids, a MIL in a wheelchair, a BIL and 2 SIL).  Our house has been taken over, and I've locked myself inside my office at least until 5 pm.  I was complaining about it for awhile to one of the team members and he eventually sent me this, and I can't stop laughing.  

@EaglePhan1986 @mikemack8

I hope you have some liquor in your home office.  

I found her: