Bwestbrook36 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 5 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: The bigger failure is their evaluation than the player, but if they drafted him to be one thing and he can’t do that thing mistakes were obviously made. Well we don't know exactly what he can do just media nonsense and whatever last year was. Let it play out Seems to me we have already labeled Reagor a JAG under the same circumstances that Hurts was under. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 7 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said: Well we don't know exactly what he can do just media nonsense and whatever last year was. Let it play out Seems to me we have already labeled Reagor a JAG under the same circumstances that Hurts was under. Well we do know what we saw last year and it was a lot of poor route running and disappointment. He also had the slower than expected 40 time at the combine to go with an overall poor season and injury. On a team that was so desperate to find any help at wide receiver the fans fell in love with Fulgham instead of any of the Eagles actual draft selections. This year he came into camp out of shape, so that already slowed him down and they had a position change. Look I hope the kid turns out, but let’s be honest too. He has not had a very good start to his career. When the Eagles drafted Desean Jackson it didn’t take very long to see he could play. Right now Reagor could go either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 4 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: Well we do know what we saw last year and it was a lot of poor route running and disappointment. He also had the slower than expected 40 time at the combine to go with an overall poor season and injury. On a team that was so desperate to find any help at wide receiver the fans fell in love with Fulgham instead of any of the Eagles actual draft selections. This year he came into camp out of shape, so that already slowed him down and they had a position change. Look I hope the kid turns out, but let’s be honest too. He has not had a very good start to his career. When the Eagles drafted Desean Jackson it didn’t take very long to see he could play. Right now Reagor could go either way. Again that's all last year what part of last year was not a cluster F? Goedert came in out of shape too also has yet to have a fully healthy season and the masses want him signed long term as the future so yeah, I'll make my own judgement here. Jackson didn't play with dog sheet at QB and coaches who catered to dog sheet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 1 minute ago, Bwestbrook36 said: Again that's all last year what part of last year was not a cluster F? Goedert came in out of shape too also has yet to have a fully healthy season and the masses want him signed long term as the future so yeah, I'll make my own judgement here. I’m not really judging the players, but so far I don’t like what I’m seeing. Truth is I’m not all that excited about Goedert either right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 Just now, EazyEaglez said: I’m not really judging the players, but so far I don’t like what I’m seeing. Truth is I’m not all that excited about Goedert either right now. I don't like any of what I saw last year. However, since Reagor has been back at camp they have been pounding into his head the importance of sharp route running and so far he has been doing that in camp. There is nothing I saw in Hurts that I liked so it's all about opinions from armchair QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 9 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said: I don't like any of what I saw last year. However, since Reagor has been back at camp they have been pounding into his head the importance of sharp route running and so far he has been doing that in camp. There is nothing I saw in Hurts that I liked so it's all about opinions from armchair QBs. In the Patriots game he was Reagor was getting jammed on the line and didn’t really get a lot of separation. In practice he supposedly owning the Pats receivers though. Smith despite his size was clearly showing he can get off the line and separate. The book on Reagor even before he came to the Eagles was he sometimes runs lazy routes. In games he hasn’t quite shown he’s improved there and the fact they’re still trying to pound that into his head shows that it’s a problem. I hope he figures it out though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 10 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: In the Patriots game he was Reagor was getting jammed on the line and didn’t really get a lot of separation. In practice he supposedly owning the Pats receivers though. Smith despite his size was clearly showing he can get off the line and separate. The book on Reagor even before he came to the Eagles was he sometimes runs lazy routes. In games he hasn’t quite shown he’s improved there and the fact they’re still trying to pound that into his head shows that it’s a problem. I hope he figures it out though. When he was drafted they said routes were going to be a problem and something he had to work on. So it's not a surprise, that he struggles there. So concentrating on routes or lack there of is going to lead to not getting separation. If he gets to a pint where he can run the routes properly without thinking about it he can then start using his physical attributes. This is nothing new these were all things said when he was drafted. He didn't have a camp last year to work on them he went straight to regular season coming off injury so yeah I guess he would struggle with something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cochis_Calhoun Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 51 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: Well we do know what we saw last year and it was a lot of poor route running and disappointment. He also had the slower than expected 40 time at the combine to go with an overall poor season and injury. On a team that was so desperate to find any help at wide receiver the fans fell in love with Fulgham instead of any of the Eagles actual draft selections. This year he came into camp out of shape, so that already slowed him down and they had a position change. Look I hope the kid turns out, but let’s be honest too. He has not had a very good start to his career. When the Eagles drafted Desean Jackson it didn’t take very long to see he could play. Right now Reagor could go either way. I don't think Doug's offense was great for receivers, Chip knew how to use Wide Receivers, Doug was better with Tight Ends, but Reagor was a disappointment last year, if Fulgham could put up the numbers he did for 5 weeks, there is little excuse for Reagor in my view, the reason we were fed for picking Reagor over pretty much every other receiver in the draft was his greasy fast speed and big play ability that was held back by weak QB play in college, and what we got was a guy who couldn't seperate, lacked acceleration and top end speed and wasn't tall enough to win contested balls caused by his lack of seperation and speed. I'll hope for the best this season but as it stands I wouldn't be surprised if we're using one of those early round picks next year on a receiver. Receiver draft next year looks like it might be deep too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 15 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said: When he was drafted they said routes were going to be a problem and something he had to work on. So it's not a surprise, that he struggles there. So concentrating on routes or lack there of is going to lead to not getting separation. If he gets to a pint where he can run the routes properly without thinking about it he can then start using his physical attributes. This is nothing new these were all things said when he was drafted. He didn't have a camp last year to work on them he went straight to regular season coming off injury so yeah I guess he would struggle with something like that. The concerning part for me is those are mental mistakes. There were reports that he was out there running the wrong routes at times. Makes one wonder if there’s is a maturity issue here. On top of that it’s still a problem that he’s working though during the season. Like I mentioned with Hurts there are some things he did last season that concerned me. Not judging him either, but you can’t just ignore this stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 5 minutes ago, Cochis_Calhoun said: I don't think Doug's offense was great for receivers, Chip knew how to use Wide Receivers, Doug was better with Tight Ends, but Reagor was a disappointment last year, if Fulgham could put up the numbers he did for 5 weeks, there is little excuse for Reagor in my view, the reason we were fed for picking Reagor over pretty much every other receiver in the draft was his greasy fast speed and big play ability that was held back by weak QB play in college, and what we got was a guy who couldn't seperate, lacked acceleration and top end speed and wasn't tall enough to win contested balls caused by his lack of seperation and speed. I'll hope for the best this season but as it stands I wouldn't be surprised if we're using one of those early round picks next year on a receiver. Agholor was a Chip pick and struggled in Kelly’s offense. I agree about Reagor though. There really isn’t any excuse for how he’s playing especially since his issues seem mental. His excuse for coming to camp out of shape was cause a friend of his died. I’m sorry that happened to his friend but that doesn’t mean he should be shirking his responsibilities. That shows a clear lack of maturity. If they’re drafting another receiver high that would be them picking six in 3 years. On a roster with old guys everywhere that’s a big issue for Howie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 19 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: The concerning part for me is those are mental mistakes. There were reports that he was out there running the wrong routes at times. Makes one wonder if there’s is a maturity issue here. On top of that it’s still a problem that he’s working though during the season. Like I mentioned with Hurts there are some things he did last season that concerned me. Not judging him either, but you can’t just ignore this stuff. I'm not ignoring it, I recognize his issues. I think he will be fine, if not I'll be sure to admit to being wrong you know I will. For now though I'm done arguing about it for because neither of us know for sure and I'm not in the business of dying on a hill defending players to look like a moron lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cochis_Calhoun Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 4 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: Agholor was a Chip pick and struggled in Kelly’s offense. I agree about Reagor though. There really isn’t any excuse for how he’s playing especially since his issues seem mental. His excuse for coming to camp out of shape was cause a friend of his died. I’m sorry that happened to his friend but that doesn’t mean he should be shirking his responsibilities. That shows a clear lack of maturity. If they’re drafting another receiver high that would be them picking six in 3 years. On a roster with old guys everywhere that’s a big issue for Howie. Agholor was a duff pick, but generally Kelly's ability to get yards with wide receivers was leaps and bounds ahead of Doug's, that last year was the only year in 3 he didn't have his number one receiver break 1300 yards and the #2 over 800, even then he got 997 yards and 8 TD's out of Jordan Matthews a level of production that Matthews has never been near since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 17 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said: I'm not ignoring it, I recognize his issues. I think he will be fine, if not I'll be sure to admit to being wrong you know I will. For now though I'm done arguing about it for because neither of us know for sure and I'm not in the business of dying on a hill defending players to look like a moron lol. For the record I’m not saying I know what he’s going to be nor am I hoping he fails so I can be right or any of that stuff. If anything I’m stating I see some troubling signs and that’s it. I want him to succeed, because I’m tired of this team drafting wide receivers. 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 Just now, Cochis_Calhoun said: Agholor was a duff pick, but generally Kelly's ability to get yards with wide receivers was leaps and bounds ahead of Doug's, that last year was the only year in 3 he didn't have his number one receiver break 1300 yards and the #2 over 800, even then he got 997 yards and 8 TD's out of Jordan Matthews a level of production that Matthews has never been near since. Chip did get some great seasons out of Jackson and Maclin and their numbers were never duplicated. I’m curious to see how this year will play out though. I don’t care if our receivers aren’t 100 plus reception guys so long as the team is winning. I don’t really think you need a 100 plus receiver guy to win anyway, but I would like to see production. If Watkins, Smith, and Reagor are the Eagles starters the TE and backs should have a lot of field to work with, because that’s a lot of speed at the receivers. Miles Sanders better be ready to make catches this year, cause he could have a lot of one on one plays with a slower linebacker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 10 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: For the record I’m not saying I know what he’s going to be nor am I hoping he fails so I can be right or any of that stuff. If anting I’m stating I see some troubling signs and that’s it. I want him to succeed, because I’m tired of this team drafting wide receivers. 😂 Me tooo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brkmsn Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 9 hours ago, Cochis_Calhoun said: There's an ocean of acceptability between what Jefferson did and what Reagor did, you hope your rookie receiver puts up Jefferson numbers, but if he'd had say a Tee Higgins rookie year shade over 900yards 6 TD's that would've been awesome, a Brandon Aiyuk 700yds and 6 TD's would've been great or hell even a Laviska Shenault 600 yards and 5 TD's would've been good, those are just the rookies off the top of my head who were picked after Reagor who's starting QB was benched or placed on IR last season (to remove the 'but QB play' defense) What Reagor did was less than 400 yards and 1TD, whatever way you slice it, that's a bum season for a first round receiver, Howie in deep drafts is just a jonah, the guy could fall into a barrel full of boobs and come out sucking his own thumb. Reagor played 11 games. Aiyuk only played 12, but he was targeted almost twice as much. A bad rookie season on a bad offense with bad QB play isn't that much of a concern. Mike Quick didn't exactly light it up as a rookie: Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G Rush Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Touch Y/Tch YScm RRTD Fmb AV Career 101 90 363 6464 17.8 61 99 3.6 64.0 1 -5 0 0 -5.0 0.0 0.0 364 17.7 6459 61 6 52 1982 23 PHI 82 9 0 10 156 15.6 1 49 1.1 17.3 10 15.6 156 1 0 3 1983*+ 24 PHI WR 82 16 16 69 1409 20.4 13 83 4.3 88.1 69 20.4 1409 13 1 11 1984* 25 PHI WR 82 14 14 61 1052 17.2 9 90 4.4 75.1 1 -5 0 -5 -5.0 -0.4 0.1 62 16.9 1047 9 0 8 1985*+ 26 PHI WR 82 16 15 73 1247 17.1 11 99 4.6 77.9 73 17.1 1247 11 1 9 1986* 27 PHI WR 82 16 16 60 939 15.7 9 75 3.8 58.7 60 15.7 939 9 1 7 1987* 28 PHI WR 82 12 12 46 790 17.2 11 61 3.8 65.8 46 17.2 790 11 3 6 1988 29 PHI WR 82 8 8 22 508 23.1 4 55 2.8 63.5 22 23.1 508 4 0 5 1989 30 PHI wr 82 6 5 13 228 17.5 2 40 2.2 38.0 13 17.5 228 2 0 2 1990 31 PHI 82 4 4 9 135 15.0 1 39 2.3 33.8 9 15.0 135 1 0 1 But he sure had a great 2nd season on the way to 5 straight Pro Bowls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 4 hours ago, brkmsn said: Reagor played 11 games. Aiyuk only played 12, but he was targeted almost twice as much. A bad rookie season on a bad offense with bad QB play isn't that much of a concern. Mike Quick didn't exactly light it up as a rookie: Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G Rush Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Touch Y/Tch YScm RRTD Fmb AV Career 101 90 363 6464 17.8 61 99 3.6 64.0 1 -5 0 0 -5.0 0.0 0.0 364 17.7 6459 61 6 52 1982 23 PHI 82 9 0 10 156 15.6 1 49 1.1 17.3 10 15.6 156 1 0 3 1983*+ 24 PHI WR 82 16 16 69 1409 20.4 13 83 4.3 88.1 69 20.4 1409 13 1 11 1984* 25 PHI WR 82 14 14 61 1052 17.2 9 90 4.4 75.1 1 -5 0 -5 -5.0 -0.4 0.1 62 16.9 1047 9 0 8 1985*+ 26 PHI WR 82 16 15 73 1247 17.1 11 99 4.6 77.9 73 17.1 1247 11 1 9 1986* 27 PHI WR 82 16 16 60 939 15.7 9 75 3.8 58.7 60 15.7 939 9 1 7 1987* 28 PHI WR 82 12 12 46 790 17.2 11 61 3.8 65.8 46 17.2 790 11 3 6 1988 29 PHI WR 82 8 8 22 508 23.1 4 55 2.8 63.5 22 23.1 508 4 0 5 1989 30 PHI wr 82 6 5 13 228 17.5 2 40 2.2 38.0 13 17.5 228 2 0 2 1990 31 PHI 82 4 4 9 135 15.0 1 39 2.3 33.8 9 15.0 135 1 0 1 But he sure had a great 2nd season on the way to 5 straight Pro Bowls. Nope rookie receivers can't have bad first years anymore even if they had no training camp and were hurt and the rest of the team was complete dog sheet. Hurts can have bad games as a rookie for those reasons though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagle45 Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 A rookie is allowed to have a rough transition in year 1. But you know what else? Sometimes rookies are allowed to excel too. That beats having to reach into the list of players who had pro-bowl/HOF careers after bad 1st years, bad 2nd years, etc. But that's just not the path that Eagle rookie draft picks under Howie ever take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cochis_Calhoun Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 13 hours ago, brkmsn said: Reagor played 11 games. Aiyuk only played 12, but he was targeted almost twice as much. A bad rookie season on a bad offense with bad QB play isn't that much of a concern. Mike Quick didn't exactly light it up as a rookie: Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G Rush Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Touch Y/Tch YScm RRTD Fmb AV Career 101 90 363 6464 17.8 61 99 3.6 64.0 1 -5 0 0 -5.0 0.0 0.0 364 17.7 6459 61 6 52 1982 23 PHI 82 9 0 10 156 15.6 1 49 1.1 17.3 10 15.6 156 1 0 3 1983*+ 24 PHI WR 82 16 16 69 1409 20.4 13 83 4.3 88.1 69 20.4 1409 13 1 11 1984* 25 PHI WR 82 14 14 61 1052 17.2 9 90 4.4 75.1 1 -5 0 -5 -5.0 -0.4 0.1 62 16.9 1047 9 0 8 1985*+ 26 PHI WR 82 16 15 73 1247 17.1 11 99 4.6 77.9 73 17.1 1247 11 1 9 1986* 27 PHI WR 82 16 16 60 939 15.7 9 75 3.8 58.7 60 15.7 939 9 1 7 1987* 28 PHI WR 82 12 12 46 790 17.2 11 61 3.8 65.8 46 17.2 790 11 3 6 1988 29 PHI WR 82 8 8 22 508 23.1 4 55 2.8 63.5 22 23.1 508 4 0 5 1989 30 PHI wr 82 6 5 13 228 17.5 2 40 2.2 38.0 13 17.5 228 2 0 2 1990 31 PHI 82 4 4 9 135 15.0 1 39 2.3 33.8 9 15.0 135 1 0 1 But he sure had a great 2nd season on the way to 5 straight Pro Bowls. Do you think Reagor's lack of targets might have had anything to do with his lack of speed and separation or his poor route running? As I said a walk on like Fulgham putting up the numbers he did in those 5 games puts the performance of Reagor into context, the targets and opportunities were there, it's like Ertz performance, yes the team played badly but Ertz was the only TE on the roster to drop off anywhere close to how much he did, the players doing their job individually well or badly contributes to the team, just as much as the other way around. It's hard to believe people are going to bat for Reagor last year, I hope he can kick on and be what he was drafted to be, but last year wasn't good enough and the performance of the team as a whole is a paltry excuse for not doing your job right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brkmsn Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Cochis_Calhoun said: Do you think Reagor's lack of targets might have had anything to do with his lack of speed and separation or his poor route running? As I said a walk on like Fulgham putting up the numbers he did in those 5 games puts the performance of Reagor into context, the targets and opportunities were there, it's like Ertz performance, yes the team played badly but Ertz was the only TE on the roster to drop off anywhere close to how much he did, the players doing their job individually well or badly contributes to the team, just as much as the other way around. It's hard to believe people are going to bat for Reagor last year, I hope he can kick on and be what he was drafted to be, but last year wasn't good enough and the performance of the team as a whole is a paltry excuse for not doing your job right. Fulgham is interesting. Why? Because when he came in, we had a lot of injuries. Missing for Wentz: week 4 --- Jeffery, DJax, Goedert, Reagor, JJAW week 5 --- Jeffery, DJax, Goedert, Reagor week 6 --- Jeffery, DJax, Goedert, Reagor week 7 --- Jeffery, Goedert, Ertz, Reagor, Sanders (DJax returns but gets hurt) week 8 --- Jeffery, DJax, Ertz, Sanders (1st game back for Reagor and Goedert) IMO, Fulgham played real well during that stretch. Wentz didn't have much choice but to target him frequently. As guys began returning, Fulgham saw fewer targets and snaps. Now if you really want to get into it, there are no WRs in the NFL that are open every play. Sometimes it's on the WR. Sometimes it's the coverage. Sometimes the QB doesn't look their way or wants to go somewhere else. Sometimes the pressure on the QB prevents a potential connection. Are you going to sit here and tell me that Wentz and Hurts were seeing every open WR last year? Sure, Reagor had rookie struggles, but there are plenty of reasons to believe he can be much more productive than last season. You can choose to dwell on last year's struggles if you want. This season is about to begin and none of that matters anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 6 minutes ago, brkmsn said: Fulgham is interesting. Why? Because when he came in, we had a lot of injuries. Missing for Wentz: week 4 --- Jeffery, DJax, Goedert, Reagor, JJAW week 5 --- Jeffery, DJax, Goedert, Reagor week 6 --- Jeffery, DJax, Goedert, Reagor week 7 --- Jeffery, Goedert, Ertz, Reagor, Sanders (DJax returns but gets hurt) week 8 --- Jeffery, DJax, Ertz, Sanders (1st game back for Reagor and Goedert) IMO, Fulgham played real well during that stretch. Wentz didn't have much choice but to target him frequently. As guys began returning, Fulgham saw fewer targets and snaps. Now if you really want to get into it, there are no WRs in the NFL that are open every play. Sometimes it's on the WR. Sometimes it's the coverage. Sometimes the QB doesn't look their way or wants to go somewhere else. Sometimes the pressure on the QB prevents a potential connection. Are you going to sit here and tell me that Wentz and Hurts were seeing every open WR last year? Sure, Reagor had rookie struggles, but there are plenty of reasons to believe he can be much more productive than last season. You can choose to dwell on last year's struggles if you want. This season is about to begin and none of that matters anymore. Finally can agree with one of your assements on a WR! Lol. Must of been the strong bond we formed over diet soda lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philafan4o8 Posted September 13, 2021 Author Share Posted September 13, 2021 great blocking WR...lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 Time to put those highlight reels together for week 1! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brkmsn Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 Philadelphia Eagles safety Marcus Epps was ruled out against Atlanta with a concussion. Wide receiver J.J. Arcega-Whiteside suffered an ankle injury and did not return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philafan4o8 Posted September 13, 2021 Author Share Posted September 13, 2021 2 hours ago, brkmsn said: Philadelphia Eagles safety Marcus Epps was ruled out against Atlanta with a concussion. Wide receiver J.J. Arcega-Whiteside suffered an ankle injury and did not return. Not like that ankle injury kept him from having any production. I gave him credit, he is a good blocking WR. He might be the best one on our team. Definitely could have used him on that 3rd down when they threw the bubble to Reagor and the slot WR (not sure if it was Watkins or Gainwell) completely whiffed on the block Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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