1 hour ago, eagle45 said:

I really thought RTK was a major Hurts fan, now I feel silly knowing we've been trolled all along.

He's very obviously a troll and a race baiter. Literally makes zero effort to hide it anymore.

6 hours ago, Diehardfan said:

So we are going all the way back to Cunningham who was plagued with an OC and a coach who didn't have a clue how to use his talents as the one example? You are really stretching to make that one work. I can't even take the end of that seriously.

We have to wait for Hurts to be in his 30's to be a better passer. To which he will still be in his rookie year. 

 

 

TL;DR

Jalen Hurts like to throw deep, but holds the e ball longer than any QB in the national football league. This is partly concerning, but also partly due to the fact he knows he can escape. The QBs on the left side are generally immobile, the QBs far right have some wheels.

It's put up or shut time for Hurts. It was actually supposed to be last year, but we gave him time. Now he claims that "this is MY team", which, of course, is BS. It's more Kelce's team than Hurts right now. Hurts has not earned the right to claim it's his team. That statement is stupid and arrogant. he has dome NOTHING to make such a claim. 

So, here we go again with giving Hurts time. Fine. I am pulling for him, but 3/4 of the way through THIS year, there had better be "put up", or else him and all his backers will have to shut up. Get it done, Hurts.

1 hour ago, Talonblood said:

It's put up or shut time for Hurts. It was actually supposed to be last year, but we gave him time. Now he claims that "this is MY team", which, of course, is BS. It's more Kelce's team than Hurts right now. Hurts has not earned the right to claim it's his team. That statement is stupid and arrogant. he has dome NOTHING to make such a claim. 

So, here we go again with giving Hurts time. Fine. I am pulling for him, but 3/4 of the way through THIS year, there had better be "put up", or else him and all his backers will have to shut up. Get it done, Hurts.

Kelce bends the knee and snaps the ball to Hurts.  It's QB1's team. 

1 hour ago, RememberTheKoy said:

Kelce bends the knee and snaps the ball to Hurts.  It's QB1's team. 

Nope. He hasn't done a damn thing to earn it. It's not his team until he proves it. I hope he does, but he hasn't up to this point. No more excuses this year- he has the WR's and TE to get it done. He better.

7 hours ago, RememberTheKoy said:

Kelce bends the knee and snaps the ball to Hurts.  It's QB1's team. 

7 hours ago, RememberTheKoy said:

Kelce bends the knee and snaps the ball to Hurts.  It's RB1's team. 

FYP

12 hours ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

 

 

 

TL;DR

Jalen Hurts like to throw deep, but holds the e ball longer than any QB in the national football league. This is partly concerning, but also partly due to the fact he knows he can escape. The QBs on the left side are generally immobile, the QBs far right have some wheels.

Lack of quick release eliminates big plays. Defenses have time to read the field. This may have worked against mostly bad teams.

2 hours ago, eagle45 said:

FYP

 

9 hours ago, RememberTheKoy said:

Kelce bends the knee and snaps the ball to Strong.  It's QB1's team.  Let’s F’n Go!!

 That’s it. 

On 5/29/2022 at 7:15 AM, eagle45 said:

Minshew is a decisively superior passer to Hurts and he's still a career backup/journeyman for good reason.

Ridiculous. In what universe, based on what we saw last year from both, is Minshew a decisively better passer? Take a look and the below or show me what Minshew did last year that Hurts didn’t do.

 

1 minute ago, Thrive said:

Ridiculous. In what universe, based on what we saw last year from both, is Minshew a decisively better passer? Take a look and the below or show me what Minshew did last year that Hurts didn’t do.

 

91.2, 95.9, 104.8

77.6, 87.2

What is the difference between these two groups of numbers?

 

14 minutes ago, Thrive said:

Ridiculous. In what universe, based on what we saw last year from both, is Minshew a decisively better passer? Take a look and the below or show me what Minshew did last year that Hurts didn’t do.

 

Another set of numbers:

3   1,764   19  and -1

That's the head to head comparison with the difference in games started, yards passing, TD, and INT.  As in...in only 3 more career starts, Minshew has 1,764 more passing yards, 19 more TDs, and 1 fewer INT.

He is unquestionably a superior passer to Hurts.  And the irony in all of this is that he's not a good passer.

 

19 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

91.2, 95.9, 104.8

77.6, 87.2

What is the difference between these two groups of numbers?

 

Going by that logic, Minshew is at least as good or better at passing than (in some cases, a decisively better passer) the following: D. Carr; Josh Allen; Matt Ryan; Carson Wertz; Jared Goff; Zach Wilson; and Justin Fields. ALL of which are starters.

It’s a silly argument and I’m not sure why you of all folks keep espousing it. 

Also, Jalen’s QB rating as a rookie was better than Trevor Lawrence, Justin Fields and Zach Wilson’s. So I guess Jalen was a better passer than those two as well as a rookie? Even though at least two of them were considered to be near-elite passing talents?

22 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Another set of numbers:

3   1,764   19  and -1

That's the head to head comparison with the difference in games started, yards passing, TD, and INT.  As in...in only 3 more career starts, Minshew has 1,764 more passing yards, 19 more TDs, and 1 fewer INT.

He is unquestionably a superior passer to Hurts.  And the irony in all of this is that he's not a good passer.

 

The low passing yardage output last year was problematic and needs to be resolved. But the implication of the passing yardage differences are probably more complex than simply denoting who the better passer is. Ultimately, I don’t have a good response if I’m being completely honest.

On 5/29/2022 at 9:09 AM, ThinkGreen said:

I'm fine with Hurts as long as they don't sign him to a $100 million contract. I'm not saying he shouldn't get one with another team.

Hopefully he gets a $100M contract with any NFCE team other than the Eagles.  

2 hours ago, eagle45 said:

91.2, 95.9, 104.8

77.6, 87.2

What is the difference between these two groups of numbers?

 

do you believe Dak Prescott is a top 10 alltime QB? 
 

Of course you don’t, because passer rating is a bogus and antiquated statistic from a time when they didn’t understand analytics and were more or less just guessing

1 hour ago, Thrive said:

Going by that logic, Minshew is at least as good or better at passing than (in some cases, a decisively better passer) the following: D. Carr; Josh Allen; Matt Ryan; Carson Wertz; Jared Goff; Zach Wilson; and Justin Fields. ALL of which are starters.

It’s a silly argument and I’m not sure why you of all folks keep espousing it. 

Also, Jalen’s QB rating as a rookie was better than Trevor Lawrence, Justin Fields and Zach Wilson’s. So I guess Jalen was a better passer than those two as well as a rookie? Even though at least two of them were considered to be near-elite passing talents?

Well, here's my issue if you want to compare Hurts to rookie seasons of other QB's...

Let's look at Peyton Manning and Trevor Lawrence.  An all-time great and an all-time great prospect.  Peyton's rookie QB rating was 71.2.  Granted, that reaches back to an era of much lower QB ratings, but that's still low.  He set an NFL int record.  He threw 575 passes and let it all hang out...he learned to be a high volume passer.  Trevor Lawrence, same thing.  71.2...not a good rookie year.  But again, 602 passes and he endured having an NFL offense that lived and died with his passing.

Dak Prescott?  Unlike Peyton and Lawrence, he was protected in a running offense with a strong OL as a rookie...459 passes.  He also responded with a precocious 104.9 QB rating from that cocoon.  Similar story with Russell Wilson.  Only 393 attempts as a rookie in a running offense.  But he also had an efficient 100.0 QB ranking.

Hurts?  In year two, he wasn't asked to do the things that Manning and Lawrence were as rookies.  He was protected like Dak and Wilson.  Hurts was both protected and bad.  

 

16 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

do you believe Dak Prescott is a top 10 alltime QB? 
 

Of course you don’t, because passer rating is a bogus and antiquated statistic from a time when they didn’t understand analytics and were more or less just guessing

Nah, you are just conflating 2 different fallacies with passer rating.  You can't compare Troy Aikman to Dak Prescott as QBs via passer rating, as the number has inflated itself over QB generations.  So no, that number doesn't make Dak Prescott a top 10 all time QB.  But you can compare 2021 QB's to 2021 QB's off that statistic.

So if you don't like passer rating, do you like completion %, total yards, deep ball accuracy, TD passes, TD/INT ratio?...because Hurts sucks in all of those stats too.

16 hours ago, Talonblood said:

It's put up or shut time for Hurts. It was actually supposed to be last year, but we gave him time. Now he claims that "this is MY team", which, of course, is BS. It's more Kelce's team than Hurts right now. Hurts has not earned the right to claim it's his team. That statement is stupid and arrogant. he has dome NOTHING to make such a claim. 

So, here we go again with giving Hurts time. Fine. I am pulling for him, but 3/4 of the way through THIS year, there had better be "put up", or else him and all his backers will have to shut up. Get it done, Hurts.

 

1 hour ago, Thrive said:

The low passing yardage output last year was problematic and needs to be resolved. But the implication of the passing yardage differences are probably more complex than simply denoting who the better passer is. Ultimately, I don’t have a good response if I’m being completely honest.

First of all Talonblood - I agree that he needs to show some substantial improvement in the next 3/4 of the season. But to be fair most of the people viewed as Hurts backers, including myself, accept that.

Thrive. Hurts was viewed as a developmental QB. His passing numbers are nothing special. But he was mostly effective in moving the ball with his arm and legs in a run heavy offense last year. People want to discount his legs.

Now he has to step up in his second full year in the system with a much better WR class. His mobility means that he doesn’t have to pass for 300 yards a game. He needs to improve, but not as much as some people think.

2 minutes ago, ManchesterEagle said:

 

His mobility means that he doesn’t have to pass for 300 yards a game. He needs to improve, but not as much as some people think.

The path to a SB for a QB who can't pass for those 300 yards in a shootout is a murky, poorly travelled one.

Jackson is a better runner with a more talented arm than Hurts and his inability to hang in the passing game has doomed the Ravens time and time again.  We are trying to see this through with a less talented version of Jackson when the original copy isn't nearly good enough.

Garbage time stat king.

1 hour ago, eagle45 said:

Nah, you are just conflating 2 different fallacies with passer rating.  You can't compare Troy Aikman to Dak Prescott as QBs via passer rating, as the number has inflated itself over QB generations.  So no, that number doesn't make Dak Prescott a top 10 all time QB.  But you can compare 2021 QB's to 2021 QB's off that statistic.

So if you don't like passer rating, do you like completion %, total yards, deep ball accuracy, TD passes, TD/INT ratio?...because Hurts sucks in all of those stats too.

He is better than Minshew in many of the important ones, which is the point of this discussion.

 

2021 Passer Rating Leaders:

1. Rodgers

2. Burrow

3. Prescott

4. Cousins

 

I disagree very strongly with how you rate your quarterbacks

That's Brady/Hurts comment by RTK is the single worst football-related take EVER on either EMB. That is a powerful accomplishment for him.

1 hour ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

He is better than Minshew in many of the important ones, which is the point of this discussion.

 

2021 Passer Rating Leaders:

1. Rodgers

2. Burrow

3. Prescott

4. Cousins

 

I disagree very strongly with how you rate your quarterbacks

Such as? 

I'm not talking about running, either.