Paye at 12 wouldn't be the worst pick. That's around where he is projected to go. I prefer a CB over a DE but the top CBs probably won't be there and it's not like we don't need the help at that position.

Now if we trade up for Paye, especially if one of the top CBs is still on the board, that I would strongly dislike.

Just now, metal said:

Paye at 12 wouldn't be the worst pick. That's around where he is projected to go. I prefer a CB over a DE but the top CBs probably won't be there and it's not like we don't need the help at that position.

Now if we trade up for Paye, especially if one of the top CBs is still on the board, that I would strongly dislike.

Paye at 12 going to a team that has true starters at DE and plays them 75-85% of the snaps isn't bad.  Using pick 12 on Paye where he is going to come in and be a rotational end even if he starts is just a bad use of resources.  I don't want our 1st round pick only playing 50% of the snaps. 

7 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Paye at 12 going to a team that has true starters at DE and plays them 75-85% of the snaps isn't bad.  Using pick 12 on Paye where he is going to come in and be a rotational end even if he starts is just a bad use of resources.  I don't want our 1st round pick only playing 50% of the snaps. 

The draft is not just about what is going to happen this year. Graham won't be here past 2022 and Barnett is not a lock to return after this season either. It's true that he won't be starting at first but If he is good enough he could certainly take over before Graham is gone, or start opposite him next year if Barnett leaves in FA. I get that not everyone is in love with the idea but it's something that the Eagles need to consider if the top WRs and CBs are gone which is a very realistic scenario.

Also we don't know what the rotation will look like. The new scheme may rotate less. So that remains to be seen.

1 minute ago, metal said:

The draft is not just about what is going to happen this year. Graham won't be here past 2022 and Barnett is not a lock to return after this season either. It's true that he won't be starting at first but If he is good enough he could certainly take over before Graham is gone, or start opposite him next year if Barnett leaves in FA. I get that not everyone is in love with the idea but it's something that the Eagles need to consider if the top WRs and CBs are gone which is a very realistic scenario.

I'm not just talking about this year though. Even in the future.  

BG started this year.  He played 69% of the snaps.

Barnett was a starter this year.  He played 49% of the snaps.

Josh Sweat played 38% of the snaps. 

 

Now you look at the Colts defense from 2020.  It looks like they do the same sort of rotating.  

Justin Houston started.  59% of defensive snaps

Denico Autry started.  61% of defensive snaps

Tyquan Lewis. 40% of defensive snaps

 

If you're going to spend pick 12 on a defensive end who plays 60% of the snaps if that, he better be a flat out stud, not just a steady grinder.  No thank you.  Draft your DE rotation in the middle rounds, fill out DE3 and DE4 with veterans and you're set.  Unless there's a Chase Young or a young JJ Watt, definitive starters who don't come off the field then I'm not interested.  

You take a LT in round 1, he's playing 100% of the snaps.  Same for QB and CB.  WR is going to start and play the majority of the snaps.  LB worthy of top 15 pick isn't coming off the field.  You take Pitts, he isn't coming off the field.

You settle for a DE, you're taking a rotational player.  I just don't like that use of high draft resources. 

55 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Kwitty Paye is steady but not dynamic.  Waddle, Horn, Surtain and yes even Smith are all dynamic, impact players.  I don't understand Howie's love affair with drafting steady players rather than dynamic playmakers.

Watching Paye highlights and Chase Winovich flashes just as much if not more than Paye at times.  Winovich was drafted at pick 77 in round 3.  Not saying Paye is a 3rd rounder but my goodness if we take him at 12...

Buckle up and get ready for Paye.

Howie has always preferred steady, safe, effort players.  The results have been embarrassing and he FINALLY did some soul searching and went for more explosive athletes in 2020...as it turns out, they all sucked as rookies.

So expect a rapid return to his old ways with safer, steady prospects.

2 hours ago, blindside said:

I like Paye. I’d be fine with it. Not primo value, maybe, but should have a real high floor and a fairly high ceiling. 

I'd much rather Kaindoh honestly.  Paye will be a good NFL player, but not much more IMO.

Paye is basically going to be a 6-8 sack per year DE who then gets compensatory biased internal raves about how "he plays the run so well and does more than register sacks.”

Thats going to be who he becomes in Philly.  If you want that at 12, go for it.  I suppose it’s safer than other options.

Just now, eagle45 said:

Paye is basically going to be a 5-7 sack per year DE who then gets compensatory biased internal raves about how "he plays the run so well and does more than register sacks.”

Thats going to be who he becomes in Philly.  If you want that at 12, go for it.  I suppose it’s safer than other options.

Fixed it.  You're aiming too high.

This Paye report better be smoke only. If they take him that would be really aggravating. Hopefully this is just to make the Giants sweat and reach.

2 minutes ago, eaglesflyers#1 said:

This Paye report better be smoke only. If they take him that would’ve really aggravating. Hopefully this is just to make the Giants sweat and reach.

Or maybe a team wants to move up for him and the Eagles are trying to extract some value. Who the hell knows? Thursday can’t get here fast enough. 

1 hour ago, Desertbirds said:

Yes, because Roseman has never overridden his scouts or coaches.

He tends to try and mediate between the two. His best drafts were when AR was emasculated after the dream team and before Chip took over, and when he ran the show before they won the SB and Doug and Schwartz got more leverage.

Now it's back to the ole "trust the board," with coaches who are more development oriented (less likely to lobby for need or "NFL ready").

Howie's skill is wheeling and dealing and finding value, give him a good board without pressure from the coaches to win now and he'll do fine.

Sometimes coaches can be good and bad, Mudd lobbied for both Watkins and Kelce. Stoutland seems to have a better draft day record.

Of course, as Graham shows, you shouldn't be quick to jump to conclusions. imagine if Hurts emerges throwing to JJAW, Reagor and Watkins with Dillard protecting his blind side. Far fetched, but stranger things have happened in the NFL (like a 3rd string refugee from NFL Europe making the HOF).

13 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Or maybe a team wants to move up for him and the Eagles are trying to extract some value. Who the hell knows? Thursday can’t get here fast enough. 

 

If they Paye is being used as a smoke screen I would think the reason is to make make a team ahead of the Eagles not worry about trading up for another player that the Eagles might be targeting in a trade up like Surtain. 

1 hour ago, bpac55 said:

Paye at 12 going to a team that has true starters at DE and plays them 75-85% of the snaps isn't bad.  Using pick 12 on Paye where he is going to come in and be a rotational end even if he starts is just a bad use of resources.  I don't want our 1st round pick only playing 50% of the snaps. 

Most teams rotate DEs and DTs. Cox plays an unusually high % of snaps, probably too many due to injury.

Thing is, if you upgrade the top of a rotation, you upgrade the whole rotation by allowing players to be more rested and to be used to best advantage.

Sure, WRs play 85% of the snaps, but unless they're exceptional run blockers, most plays they're just decoys, and often not very good ones.

5 minutes ago, austinfan said:

He tends to try and mediate between the two. His best drafts were when AR was emasculated after the dream team and before Chip took over, and when he ran the show before they won the SB and Doug and Schwartz got more leverage.

Now it's back to the ole "trust the board," with coaches who are more development oriented (less likely to lobby for need or "NFL ready").

Howie's skill is wheeling and dealing and finding value, give him a good board without pressure from the coaches to win now and he'll do fine.

Sometimes coaches can be good and bad, Mudd lobbied for both Watkins and Kelce. Stoutland seems to have a better draft day record.

Of course, as Graham shows, you shouldn't be quick to jump to conclusions. imagine if Hurts emerges throwing to JJAW, Reagor and Watkins with Dillard protecting his blind side. Far fetched, but stranger things have happened in the NFL (like a 3rd string refugee from NFL Europe making the HOF).

Doug couldn’t put his own coaching staff together and you’re trying to spin this nonsense that he had say over our top picks?

Stop. 

6 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

If they Paye is being used as a smoke screen I would think the reason is to make make a team ahead of the Eagles not worry about trading up for another player that the Eagles might be targeting in a trade up like Surtain. 

Could be. Depends on the Eagles’ motivation. Do they want a player to fall or do they want to trade back?

1 minute ago, ManuManu said:

Doug couldn’t put his own coaching staff together and you’re trying to spin this nonsense that he had say over our top picks?

Stop. 

Tracy Rucker has final say on which DL we pick if we go that direction in the 1st, if you didn't know... lol

35 minutes ago, eaglesflyers#1 said:

This Paye report better be smoke only. If they take him that would be really aggravating. Hopefully this is just to make the Giants sweat and reach.

Could be smoke but could be true. Pauline nailed the Reagor pick last year a few days before the draft. 

11 minutes ago, LeanMeanGM said:

Could be smoke but could be true. Pauline nailed the Reagor pick last year a few days before the draft. 

Barf if true

1 hour ago, austinfan said:

What cracks me up is this draft (and the next one) Howie is almost certainly going to follow the board put together by the scouts with input but not control by the coaches.

So people are preparing to criticize him for doing what they criticized him for not doing. Which is why fans are generally a-holes.

If Paye is their player, it's going to be because the scouts and Rucker lobbied hard for him over an offensive player.

And it'll be because they studied the film and combined with his athleticism, see him as a better pro than college player.

And yes, Graham was a fine pick at #12, after overcoming injuries he's put together an excellent career, he's not an elite sack guy but a better player than many DEs who have more sacks b/c he's a plus run defense who plays a disciplined game (controls the edge) and gets a lot of pressure, not just sacks.

 

Graham delivered almost 3x as many sacks in college. He produced. 

To both the FO haters and the FO huggers...this isn’t elementary school algebra.

All that matters are results.  I don’t care who Howie deferred to or who he overruled.  No one cares about the process.

Hes the GM.  I don’t care that he has his own board and overrules the scouts.  That’s what GMs are supposed to do.  I care that his picks suck.

I think eagles are in a not so great spot, unless you’re drafting a bama WO at 12 , otherwise I trade back , maybe even up , 12 is no mans land IMO 

2 hours ago, vikas83 said:

Stop it. Just stop it. Why do you want to hurt us?

Not trying to give you nightmares, but it's best to be prepared for the worst so that you won't throw your remote control through your HD TV out of immediate anger/surprised digust. Although, that still could happen.  Howie could be responsible for damages to thousands of tv sets come Thursday night.

Per Bob McGinnis
 

 

 

 

12 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

To both the FO haters and the FO huggers...this isn’t elementary school algebra.

All that matters are results.  I don’t care who Howie deferred to or who he overruled.  No one cares about the process.

Hes the GM.  I don’t care that he has his own board and overrules the scouts.  That’s what GMs are supposed to do.  I care that his picks suck.

I care about all of it, because all of it matters. 

Per nfl updates

very true

 

One thing the #49ers strongly believe: Whichever new QB comes in will have Deebo, Aiyuk, Kittle, Trent Williams at LT, one of the best offensive minds at HC, and a defense that is top-5 when fully healthy.

A No. 3 overall QB never gets that. Situationally, it doesn't get better.