2 minutes ago, Mike31mt said:

But then we all did, right?  We all trusted Trump and took the vaccine that was developed under Trump's administration

So what he said was irresponsible and clearly political in nature

That quote was from September of 2020, moron. The vaccine wasn't approved and released until December. Do you even understand how the concept of time works?

2 minutes ago, Mike31mt said:

But then we all did, right?  We all trusted Trump and took the vaccine that was developed under Trump's administration

So what he said was irresponsible and clearly political in nature

No, not all. 25% of the country, the majority of which are from your mindset and political tribe, most certainly did not trust the vaccine. 

32 minutes ago, Procus said:

This mandate will be litigated, likely up to the Supreme Court.  Cruz thinks its illegal and that the Chief of Staff re-tweet is an admission of such.  I think it's an overreach - but by no means is this a slam dunk that the Supreme Court will overturn it.  Much closer call than the CDC overreach with the eviction moratorium.

Still, an idiotic RT by the COS, which is indicative of the high level of incompetence of this administration.

 

I don't think it will be overturned:  See Jacobson v. Massachusetts LINK

Quote

It is within the police power of a State to enact a compulsory vaccination law

Now, Biden has gone about this a totally different way.... In 1905, local governments had enacted laws requiring its residents to be vaccinated against smallpox, which Supreme Court upheld 7-2. Today, Biden is going through OSHA to make it a nationwide mandate for workers to be vaccinated against COVID-19 as a work safety measure. There will be arguments both for/against, for sure.

I agree with Vikas. If the unvaccinated don't want the vaccine and refuse to wear masks, and they get Covid, they should be made to pay for their own medical treatment or even be denied admission to the hospital. They deserve to be treated differently. The tyranny of the minority puts us all in danger.

2 minutes ago, mattmcginley7 said:

No surprise everyone's vaccine take is conveniently in perfect alignment with their party 

I think both sides have handled this horifficly. It's a joke 

If this is a precursor to some forthcoming anti-vax nonsense, spare us. Vaccines were never a political wedge issue until a moron decided to abhorrently downplay the worst pandemic in a century during an election year.

1 minute ago, we_gotta_believe said:

If this is a precursor to some forthcoming anti-vax nonsense, spare us. Vaccines were never a political wedge issue until a moron decided to abhorrently downplay the worst pandemic in a century during an election year.

Damn right. They didn't complain about the Polio Vaccine, or the Small Pox vaccine or the Swine Flu vaccine. it's political because most of them are totally delusional and the tyranny of the minority, puts the majority of us in danger. It's time for Biden to get even tougher on them. 

Just now, we_gotta_believe said:

If this is a precursor to some forthcoming anti-vax nonsense, spare us. Vaccines were never a political wedge issue until a moron decided to abhorrently downplay the worst pandemic in a century during an election year.

I took the vaccine and I'm healthier than everyone lol 

The average American thinks their probability of dying from Covid is 1000x times higher than it actually is. Why can't we contextually frame everything in reality instead of fear mongering?

Vaccines will help end the pandemic, but those previously infected with covid have higher immunity than those who get vaccines

You do realize you can simultaneously acknowledge both of these things as true?

does anyone really think that the honorable president donald trump would've pushed though a vaccine that wasn't fully ready before november 3rd, just so he could take credit for it right before the election. do you really think he'd do such a thing?   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just now, mattmcginley7 said:

I took the vaccine and I'm healthier than everyone lol 

The average American thinks their probability of dying from Covid is 1000x times higher than it actually is. Why can't we contextually frame everything in reality instead of fear mongering?

Vaccines will help end the pandemic, but those previously infected with covid have higher immunity than those who get vaccines

You do realize you can simultaneously acknowledge both of these things as true?

Source, please.

Solid explanatory graph for why people are vaccine hesitant:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fortune.com/2021/08/27/covid-natural-immunity-vaccine-delta-variant-pfizer-protection/amp/

1 minute ago, mattmcginley7 said:

https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html

Look, I'm not sure what the deal is today, but I've already reached my "teach people how to read" quota.

2 minutes ago, mattmcginley7 said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fortune.com/2021/08/27/covid-natural-immunity-vaccine-delta-variant-pfizer-protection/amp/

From your 1st link:

"If you have had COVID-19 before, please still get vaccinated,” said CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky. "This study shows you are twice as likely to get infected again if you are unvaccinated. Getting the vaccine is the best way to protect yourself and others around you, especially as the more contagious Delta variant spreads around the country.”

3 minutes ago, mattmcginley7 said:

I took the vaccine and I'm healthier than everyone lol 

The average American thinks their probability of dying from Covid is 1000x times higher than it actually is. Why can't we contextually frame everything in reality instead of fear mongering?

Vaccines will help end the pandemic, but those previously infected with covid have higher immunity than those who get vaccines

You do realize you can simultaneously acknowledge both of these things as true?

Yeah, I know a few Covid Victims who believe they are immune but have never had an antibody test to prove it. They just claim it because they heard it on Joe Rogan or OAN or News max or Fox News or because Steve Bannon or Alex Jones told them it was so. 

Other than that, where's the science to prove it they have higher immunity than those who get vaccines. Link? 

4 minutes ago, Kz! said:

Solid explanatory graph for why people are vaccine hesitant:

Your graph is missing important details: Like what is the outcome of the vaccinated vs. unvaccinated after they are infected?

If you think COVID is going to simply disappear one day, you've been duped.

1 minute ago, toolg said:

Your graph is missing important details: Like what is the outcome of the vaccinated vs. unvaccinated after they are infected?

If you think COVID is going to simply disappear one day, you've been duped.

Missing details. Hahahahahahah. 

 

Look forward to employers requiring their employees to get vaccinated or lose their job. 

Good luck to the unvaccinated. 

6 minutes ago, we_gotta_believe said:

Look, I'm not sure what the deal is today, but I've already reached my "teach people how to read" quota.

I had the wrong link copied.

https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-once-confers-much-greater-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital

1 minute ago, jsdarkstar said:

Yeah, I know a few Covid Victims who believe they are immune but have never had an antibody test to prove it. They just claim it because they heard it on Joe Rogan or OAN or News max or Fox News or because Steve Bannon or Alex Jones told them it was so. 

Other than that, where's the science to prove it they have higher immunity than those who get vaccines. Link? 

I have 2 SILs that have not gotten the vaccine for different reasons - 1 is acting under the guidance of her doctors because she is trying to get pregnant including fertility treatments. The other is just generally anti-vaccine. Both had Covid around the New Years last year. 
 

The anti-vaccine one has no problem wearing her mask around us and has gotten an antibody test to confirm that she still has natural immunity. Her plan is to get tested periodically and get the vaccine when her natural immunity fades. 
 

The other one will wear a mask around us but is clearly annoyed by our request and, to my knowledge, hasn’t gotten an antibody test but just assumes she’s immune to it since she already had it. 
 

I also know of a guy in his early 20’s that had Covid twice about 8 months apart. The 2nd time was less severe with only minor symptoms. 

Not sure if this was posted here yet.  LA USD mandates vaccine for all students 12 and older.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/09/us/los-angeles-schools-vaccine-mandate-students/index.html

Just now, RPeeteRules said:

Not sure if this was posted here yet.  LA USD mandates vaccine for all students 12 and older.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/09/us/los-angeles-schools-vaccine-mandate-students/index.html

Great news. If parents want their kids to go to school, then they should be vaccinated. If parents refuse, they can stay home from work and home school their kids. 

3 minutes ago, mattmcginley7 said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fortune.com/2021/08/27/covid-natural-immunity-vaccine-delta-variant-pfizer-protection/amp/

Oh, you edited your post when you realized you refuted your own argument. This is better, but it had some limitations given the time frame they were evaluating (Jan-Feb) where vaccinations were prioritized for the elderly, those with pre-existing conditions, and the immunocompromised. Let's see if this is corroborated by other studies. In any case though, it's clear that the third group in the study (those with prior infection that still got vaccinated) saw benefit to vaccination from even further increased protection.

9 minutes ago, RPeeteRules said:

Not sure if this was posted here yet.  LA USD mandates vaccine for all students 12 and older.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/09/us/los-angeles-schools-vaccine-mandate-students/index.html

Good. More of this please.

3 minutes ago, jsdarkstar said:

Great news. If parents want their kids to go to school, then they should be vaccinated. If parents refuse, they can stay home from work and home school their kids. 

More kids die from the flu on an average yearly basis than have died from Covid. Before the Delta variant was the dominant variant, literally 0 children died from alpha that didn't already have a significant health problem.

Maybe delta is worse, and the probability of developing myocarditis is higher compared to getting covid, but between natural immunity from a previous infection and their significantly low risk of any problems, it's not as obvious as some people attempt to make it out to be

I think it's pretty clear vaccines are incredibly helpful for high risk and still helpful, albeit much less for healthy and young people. But if parents are so hellbent on not getting their kids vaccinated, the results show it's not much of a problem

 

 

3 minutes ago, Imp81318 said:

I have 2 SILs that have not gotten the vaccine for different reasons - 1 is acting under the guidance of her doctors because she is trying to get pregnant including fertility treatments. The other is just generally anti-vaccine. Both had Covid around the New Years last year. 
 

The anti-vaccine one has no problem wearing her mask around us and has gotten an antibody test to confirm that she still has natural immunity. Her plan is to get tested periodically and get the vaccine when her natural immunity fades. 
 

The other one will wear a mask around us but is clearly annoyed by our request and, to my knowledge, hasn’t gotten an antibody test but just assumes she’s immune to it since she already had it. 
 

I also know of a guy in his early 20’s that had Covid twice about 8 months apart. The 2nd time was less severe with only minor symptoms. 

Anecdotally, I can only speak of folks who were infected by Covid either with or without vaccination. Those who were infected while unvaccinated had wildly different outcomes: from mild illness, to hospitalization, on ventilators, and I know of a few people who died. On the other hand, of those who were vaccinated first, all had relatively mild illness. All were able to recover at home. Even those of older age who watched friends of the same age get sick and go to the hospital. Everybody had the classic symptoms: loss of taste/smell and respiratory illness.

The belief is long-term, as folks are exposed to coronavirus either by vaccination or by infection, that subsequent waves of the virus will become more mild. Covid won't go away completely, but it will be less dangerous. It won't kill millions of people every year.