Jalen Hurts - shoulder sprain injury; expected for playoffs

[Next_Up]

6 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Sure sport.  Your life is so fulfilled that you’ve spent all day trying to spike the football on posters on a message board.  You have been telling us all day how you’re not on here all day.  

Day off today and happy with yesterday's win. It is a pleasure to be on the computer doing work at home and reading the posts. Except yours, of course. I don't recall writing anything about not being on here all day but clearly you researched it. What was it you wrote about stalking? Bish, indeed. 

[DawkinsOwnage03]

23 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Sick burn.  
 

I’ll make a deal with you.  We finish with 11 or more wins and make it to the 2nd round of the postseason and Hurts continues this track, I’ll start a thread admitting I was wrong and I’ll tag you and the others. If we don’t, I won’t.  

That’s a tall order what about 11 wins and playoffs?

[Next_Up]

3 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

You quoted me, about the amount of posting I do, you dunce.  How is that "stalking”. You always leaving the confused smiley on my posts in the blog.   😆. Yeah, you’re never around.  I work from home and not traveling as much.  Trust me, I’d rather be busier.  And I rarely post during the day on the weekend.   I did last night, so I can heap praise on my QB1.  They should sign him to a long term deal tomorrow.  

I really do enjoy posting the confused smiley on your posts since it is lampooning your moronic use the same emoji. I didn't think the day could get any better but now it has. Glad to get under your skin, snowflake. 

[Shalodeep]

19 minutes ago, DawkinsOwnage03 said:

That’s a tall order what about 11 wins and playoffs?

But we did the playoff thing last year 

[eagle45]

57 minutes ago, brkmsn said:

Both Cunningham and McNabb improved with experience and developed into better passers. Neither entered the NFL and set the world on fire from day 1. It took time. Era has avsolutely nothing to do with development and patience. 

Neither was good enough in their final product...

[eagle45]

Look, every player needs 2, really 3 years to mature into a reasonable manifestation of their best potential.  I don't think that was ever debated.

The real question is what a player needs to do to GET that 2-3 year commitment.  Clayton Thorson and Carson Strong never got that.  (Those are extremes, obviously).  Plenty of 2nd and 3rd round picks at QB never get that.  Almost all 1st round picks get that.

I argued that the natural talent and early returns of Jalen Hurts just weren't enough to justify that commitment.  It's absolutely unusual...no, extremely rare...for a non-first round pick who struggled through 2 years to get that commitment.  But Hurts got it.  And so far this year, kudos to the franchise brain trust and Hurts for making it look like this might work.

[D-Shiznit]

I was watching Dilfer and Sean Payton on the Herd today in separate interviews, and both said the same thing about Hurts:

1) Hurts has put in the work in the off-season and it is really paying off.

2) Hurts' confidence is growing by the snap and you can see him taking the next step before our eyes.

[Aerolithe_Lion]

3 hours ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Sick burn.  
 

I’ll make a deal with you.  We finish with 11 or more wins and make it to the 2nd round of the postseason and Hurts continues this track, I’ll start a thread admitting I was wrong and I’ll tag you and the others. If we don’t, I won’t.  

Why even entice him with such a deal, you know you'd never actually do that

 

Or do you mean there's just a 0% chance of it happening

[EazyEaglez]

2 hours ago, eagle45 said:

Look, every player needs 2, really 3 years to mature into a reasonable manifestation of their best potential.  I don't think that was ever debated.

The real question is what a player needs to do to GET that 2-3 year commitment.  Clayton Thorson and Carson Strong never got that.  (Those are extremes, obviously).  Plenty of 2nd and 3rd round picks at QB never get that.  Almost all 1st round picks get that.

I argued that the natural talent and early returns of Jalen Hurts just weren't enough to justify that commitment.  It's absolutely unusual...no, extremely rare...for a non-first round pick who struggled through 2 years to get that commitment.  But Hurts got it.  And so far this year, kudos to the franchise brain trust and Hurts for making it look like this might work.

Honestly I don’t think they had a choice, but the plan was always to eventually hand the keys over to Hurts. I just don’t think they planned on doing it as early as they did. The believed that they could squeeze another year or two out of Carson. They did not prepare for his meltdown or his trade request. They thought they had time and they were wrong, but once the plan was in play they took the risk. They knew they had to eat that cap hit which severely ruined their chances to make moves so the put themselves in a position to acquire a lot more picks and eventually used those picks, sacrificed a year that they did much better than they anticipated, all to culminate to this season where they got the picks, and the Wentz money off the books. They surrounded their guy with some weapons and a great line. I know the narrative is that the Eagles never put weapons around Wentz, but the reality is they have always tried to give him weapons and a great line. It’s basically the same blueprint and they’re utilizing their opportunities to stack the team while they’re not paying a quarterback. The Eagles always had a plan here and when they were forced to make an audible Howie Roseman knocked it out the park. So far so good. The Eagles never doubted Hurts. Everyone else has.

[eagle45]

10 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Honestly I don’t think they had a choice, but the plan was always to eventually hand the keys over to Hurts. I just don’t think they planned on doing it as early as they did. The believed that they could squeeze another year or two out of Carson. They did not prepare for his meltdown or his trade request. They thought they had time and they were wrong, but once the plan was in play they took the risk. They knew they had to eat that cap hit which severely ruined their chances to make moves so the put themselves in a position to acquire a lot more picks and eventually used those picks, sacrificed a year that they did much better than they anticipated, all to culminate to this season where they got the picks, and the Wentz money off the books. They surrounded their guy with some weapons and a great line. I know the narrative is that the Eagles never put weapons around Wentz, but the reality is they have always tried to give him weapons and a great line. It’s basically the same blueprint and they’re utilizing their opportunities to stack the team while they’re not paying a quarterback. The Eagles always had a plan here and when they were forced to make an audible Howie Roseman knocked it out the park. So far so good. The Eagles never doubted Hurts. Everyone else has.

Carson dug his own grave, but I think Brown/Smith/Watkins >>>>> 2017 Jeffery/Agholor/Torrey Smith (that was the best trio Wentz ever had as an Eagle).

Granted, Wentz had prime Ertz.  And with respect to Goedert, who may be better with YAC and blocking, Ertz was a much better pure receiving TE.

[brkmsn]

3 hours ago, eagle45 said:

Neither was good enough in their final product...

Neither was Dan Marino, Jim Kelly, Warren Moon, Fran Tarkenton, Dan Fouts or Sonny Jurgensen. Or maybe some of these guys were, but their teams weren't ... or there just happened to be a better team at the time. 

3 hours ago, eagle45 said:

Look, every player needs 2, really 3 years to mature into a reasonable manifestation of their best potential.  I don't think that was ever debated.

The real question is what a player needs to do to GET that 2-3 year commitment.  Clayton Thorson and Carson Strong never got that.  (Those are extremes, obviously).  Plenty of 2nd and 3rd round picks at QB never get that.  Almost all 1st round picks get that.

I argued that the natural talent and early returns of Jalen Hurts just weren't enough to justify that commitment.  It's absolutely unusual...no, extremely rare...for a non-first round pick who struggled through 2 years to get that commitment.  But Hurts got it.  And so far this year, kudos to the franchise brain trust and Hurts for making it look like this might work.

Thorson showed no flashes whatsoever in his preseason games here. Strong showed no flashes whatsoever in training camp. I'm not sure what you're insinuating here, but Hurts showed qualities they liked when they drafted him. They likely envisioned him as a gimmick playmaker early while he developed as a more complete player while backing up a franchise QB that was fresh off an extension.

A horrible season by the entire team gave him an opportunity to start games as a rookie and he showed he could be competitive in the NFL as a QB. In his second season, he won the starting job in training camp under a new coaching staff and played above himself in week 1. He then struggled for a few weeks to run an offense that he wasn't advanced enough to play well in consistently. They revamped the whole offensive scheme to feature his strengths and he helped turn a bad team into a winning team by the end of the season. Consistency was still an issue, but he was making improvements as a passer. The coaches and FO were well aware of how much work Hurts was doing year round to improve as a player. They see him in practice. They see him in the film room. They know what he knows and see how he learns and watch how he matures and improves. They're doing this with each player on the team. Hurts earned his "continuation" of the opportunity the team gave him. 

Honestly, a person would have to either be blind (least likely) or in complete denial (most likely) to not understand why they never pulled the plug on the Hurts experiment. Yes, Howie is always on the phone looking for opportunities to build a better team. He certainly gave serious considerations to the pros and cons of acquiring Watson or Wilson. In the end, he probably drove up the cost on both players which is also good, but he clearly felt better about giving another season to Hurts and keeping assets. Look at the acquisitions we made this year. Many of those probably won't be on this team next year. He absolutely has confidence Hurts can help this team be a legit contender right now. 

[vaff]

Lotta hostility in this thread.

[Aerolithe_Lion]

2 hours ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

 No.  I will.   

Why even mention that? It basically destroys everything you’ve worked for over the last 2 years on this board. That kind of thread does you no favors.

Just ignore that other poster

[brkmsn]

12 minutes ago, Aerolithe_Lion said:

Why even mention that? It basically destroys everything you’ve worked for over the last 2 years on this board. That kind of thread does you no favors.

Just ignore that other poster

[EazyEaglez]

9 hours ago, eagle45 said:

Carson dug his own grave, but I think Brown/Smith/Watkins >>>>> 2017 Jeffery/Agholor/Torrey Smith (that was the best trio Wentz ever had as an Eagle).

Granted, Wentz had prime Ertz.  And with respect to Goedert, who may be better with YAC and blocking, Ertz was a much better pure receiving TE.

I agree these guys are better, but Jeffery was the best receiver available at that time, the Eagles drafted Agholor and for that season he was better than anything Watkins has done so far, and Smith helped them win that Lombardi too. Those guys proved it by making big plays that year in games where it mattered the most. Ertz caught 100 passes that year which was insane. On paper the Eagles current group is better, but those 2017 guys won the big one. There are other names that the Eagles tried to provide Wentz that just don’t work out too like Jackson, Matthews, and Mike Wallace to name a few. The Eagles also drafted Reagor and Quez while Wentz was still starting. Reagor was a mistake both quarterbacks had to endure. 

[brkmsn]

2 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

I agree these guys are better, but Jeffery was the best receiver available at that time, the Eagles drafted Agholor and for that season he was better than anything Watkins has done so far, and Smith helped them win that Lombardi too. Those guys proved it by making big plays that year in games where it mattered the most. Ertz caught 100 passes that year which was insane. On paper the Eagles current group is better, but those 2017 guys won the big one. There are other names that the Eagles tried to provide Wentz that just don’t work out too like Jackson, Matthews, and Mike Wallace to name a few. The Eagles also drafted Reagor and Quez while Wentz was still starting. Reagor was a mistake both quarterbacks had to endure. 

You forgot JJAW.

[EazyEaglez]

21 minutes ago, brkmsn said:

You forgot JJAW.

Yeah not a good pick.

[Iggles_Phan]

10 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

Honestly I don’t think they had a choice, but the plan was always to eventually hand the keys over to Hurts. 

That's not true.  The plan was eventually to flip Hurts for more picks.  Wentz was the guy.  They gave him the contract, he had the MVP level season.  Hurts was brought in as a gadget player (Taysom Hill was their comp) and a backup QB/insurance policy.  All things going to plan, he wouldn't have had sufficient tape to justify moving on with him if Wentz continued to play at the level that caused him to give him the deal they did and he remained healthy, before Hurts' rookie deal would have expired.  

But, things change in the NFL, and Wentz couldn't handle the mental side of what he had to deal with.  (And frankly, no other QB has ever been put in that situation.  2nd year, MVP level play... gets hurt.  Backup plays poorly at first, then hits a magical stretch for 2.5 games, maybe only 2 games, because the Eagles were fairly fortunate to even get past the Falcons... then the magic of the NFC CG and Super Bowl.   A statue is erected of Foles.  Foles is kept around looking over Wentz' shoulder  - Foles was pretty bad early that year, and wasn't much better late either.   Then Wentz plays with grocery store clerks as his primary weapons on the outside in 2019, gets concussed in the playoffs on a cheap shot... and then his team drafts a QB in Round 2, after drafting a DUD in Round 1, missing on the obvious choice in Jefferson.)  

But, I don't think that there's any case to be made that plan A was to move on from Wentz and go to Hurts at the moment he was selected.  The circumstances changed and Wentz wanted out.   NFL means Not For Long.

[Talonblood]

Hurts has improved. If he continues like this, I can't see why people would hate on a guy who is helping their team win. And I really don't care, because they have deeper issues and aren't worth wasting your typing on. 💩

[NOTW]

Hurts really has so many qualities that Philly fans typically like in their athletes, it's weird some people just hate him so much.  Mental toughness, work ethic, he takes responsibility.  Even in wins or strong performances, he talks all business and working to improve, it's a team game, etc.  He has the respect of his teammates.  

Last year he showed some improvement but I was still concerned about his accuracy and going through all of his reads.  So far, he's proven to make a bigger improvement in those areas.  I get the sense that he knows the critiques and is working on them.

Plenty of QBs hit their stride in year 3 or 4.  Many QBs who have become great took that long. So far it's really fun to watch.  There will be some challenges this season and I'm excited to see how he handles the pressure, or recovers from a bad performance or loss.  Continuing to refine, grow and take the next leap.  

I completely understand preferring a pure pocket passer or not liking his style of play...but he seems so likeable and the kind of player Philly loves yet some people still hate him, it's crazy.  

[EaglesRocker97]

13 hours ago, eagle45 said:

Look, every player needs 2, really 3 years to mature into a reasonable manifestation of their best potential.

 

Correct

 

13 hours ago, eagle45 said:

I don't think that was ever debated.

 

Well, it wasn't debated, because the detractors had no interest in qualifying that position. They just laughed, said Hurts sucks, and called you a "hugger." Suffice it to say, there were plenty of people who did not accept the logic of giving a developmental QB several seasons to prove himself.

 

13 hours ago, eagle45 said:

I argued that the natural talent and early returns of Jalen Hurts just weren't enough to justify that commitment.  It's absolutely unusual...no, extremely rare...for a non-first round pick who struggled through 2 years to get that commitment. 

 

That's a weird argument, because the talent and athleticism was always there to enough of a degree to let Hurts play it out, and I don't think it's as unusual as you think. Lamar Jackson comes to mind here, a second-round pick who still had major questions as a passer heading into his second full year as a starter.

[Mike030270]

27 minutes ago, Talonblood said:

Hurts has improved. If he continues like this, I can't see why people would hate on a guy who is helping their team win. And I really don't care, because they have deeper issues and aren't worth wasting your typing on. 💩

21 minutes ago, NOTW said:

Hurts really has so many qualities that Philly fans typically like in their athletes, it's weird some people just hate him so much.  Mental toughness, work ethic, he takes responsibility.  Even in wins or strong performances, he talks all business and working to improve, it's a team game, etc.  He has the respect of his teammates.  

Last year he showed some improvement but I was still concerned about his accuracy and going through all of his reads.  So far, he's proven to make a bigger improvement in those areas.  I get the sense that he knows the critiques and is working on them.

Plenty of QBs hit their stride in year 3 or 4.  Many QBs who have become great took that long. So far it's really fun to watch.  There will be some challenges this season and I'm excited to see how he handles the pressure, or recovers from a bad performance or loss.  Continuing to refine, grow and take the next leap.  

I completely understand preferring a pure pocket passer or not liking his style of play...but he seems so likeable and the kind of player Philly loves yet some people still hate him, it's crazy.  

Can you two give examples of this hate you're referring to?

[EaglesRocker97]

4 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

Can you two give examples of this hate you're referring to?

Search function is your friend. Look up some Godfather or Diehard posts with a Hurts keyword.

[Mike030270]

4 minutes ago, EaglesRocker97 said:

Search function is your friend. Look up some @Godfather or @Diehardfan posts with a Hurts keyword.

So 2 people. Ok

[EaglesRocker97]

4 minutes ago, Mike030270 said:

So 2 people. Ok

 

This is sad and pathetic.