e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, mr_hunt said: it all comes down to what they can get for ben, imo. if they get a legit creator/shooter & maybe another useful piece, i think they'd be fine. not having ben clog up the paint will do wonders for embiid. they don't guard ben outside of 10 feet from the basket...it's ridiculous...even if they're stuck with tobi, he'd be the 3rd scoring option & i think they could get by with that. it only takes 1 gm who's in love with ben's defense. Idk I’ve always been of the thought tobi isn’t good enough imo. I think in the playoffs when the competition gets better he tends to shrink. 2019 vs. the Raptors he shot 38% and 27% from three. Against the Celtics 38% and 13% from three. The last 6 quarters i think the hawks have figured him out and Collins has basically made him practically useless. He’s 4-16 with 0 threes over the last 6 quarters. In the last 2 4th quarters he’s gone 1-5. I think if Hunter was playing for atlanta his numbers would be worse in this series then just the last two games. Hunter is their best defender so they have made him look pathetic the last 6 quarters without that guy playing a single minute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 Id take Rick over glenn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 About to be 11 for glenn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_hunt Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said: Idk I’ve always been of the thought tobi isn’t good enough imo. I think in the playoffs when the competition gets better he tends to shrink. 2019 vs. the Raptors he shot 38% and 27% from three. Against the Celtics 38% and 13% from three. The last 6 quarters i think the hawks have figured him out and Collins has basically made him practically useless. He’s 4-16 with 0 threes over the last 6 quarters. In the last 2 4th quarters he’s gone 1-5. I think if Hunter was playing for atlanta his numbers would be worse in this series then just the last two games. Hunter is their best defender so they have made him look pathetic the last 6 quarters without that guy playing a single minute. i'm talking about tobi as the 3rd option...or even 4th if seth is on. don't get me wrong, i'd trade tobi too if they could find a deal somewhere. i just don't see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 8 minutes ago, mr_hunt said: i'm talking about tobi as the 3rd option...or even 4th if seth is on. don't get me wrong, i'd trade tobi too if they could find a deal somewhere. i just don't see it. I think you can if you are willing to take expiring contracts back or contracts in a year from now become expiring that you can use in trades that benefits you. But you are definitely downgrading for 21-22 some ideas: Harris for Aaron gordon and Barton (2 years left at 13 mil a piece). Basically clears 17 mil of space for 22-23 (Gordon is an expiring contract this upcoming year) and Barton can be used as an expiring contract that offseason in 22-23 offseason Harris for Wiggins, pascal and looney and picks. Both have two years left (looney and wiggins)so the summer of 22-23 offseason both would be expiring contracts and could do a sign and trade with them or trade them as expiring contracts to a rebuilding team. The draft picks is the most ideal thing here as you likely get some good quality picks this year as warriors own Minnesota’s and their own lottery harris for Covington, nurkic and Derrick Jones jr. all have expiring contracts going into next year would clear roughly $30 mil again none of those deals help you next year get better but for 22-23 season you could gain cap space and also have expiring contracts to make some nice moves with. But you’d basically have to be comfortable taking a step back to take a bigger step forward in 22-23 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaEagles4Life Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 Embiid doesn't have years to waste and we saw what Aaron Gordon was on a good team when they have actual other talent, it wasn't pretty. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 18 minutes ago, DaEagles4Life said: Embiid doesn't have years to waste and we saw what Aaron Gordon was on a good team when they have actual other talent, it wasn't pretty. Oh i don’t want Aaron Gordon for long term i want him cause it clears 17 mil of cap at the end of 21-22 season and Barton i could use as part of an expiring contract in a sign and trade. Like i said that trade isn’t making the sixers better next year but giving you the potential for 22-23 to actually build a much better team around embiid then keeping Harris and Simmons. I get they lack time with embiid but i also think Harris and Simmons aren’t winning pieces in a championship team and in either of those trades I’m not sure you are getting those pieces that are If Harris didn’t consistently disappear as games got bigger in the postseason I’d agree keep him. However i just don’t think he’s a championship winning player so if i can somehow clear his cap number which is $35 mil+ per season the next 3 years and do it a year or two sooner I’m all for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gannan Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 3 hours ago, Khani1 said: I’m feeling better and better about us winning Friday. I know it’s making a lot of people mad and I understand. If I’m wrong, I will punish myself since I will have annoyed enough of you. I won’t post for a week. They lost last night because they have zero heart. Not sure how they get a heart transplant by tomorrow night. I think they get blown out. It’s over and every guy on the team knows it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gannan Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 2 hours ago, mr_hunt said: i keep coming back to the bulls as a destination for ben. they have perimeter bigs in vucavic & markannan who also aren't the best at D...so ben would help them there. idk about their backcourt shooters though...or if they'd be comfortable with coby white & ben playing together. Bay are sports talk is talking about Wiggins for Ben. Makes sense, 2 underachieving #1 picks and the salaries match. Ben would be great on that team. Play the 3 and just pass, rebound and play defense while the other guys shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 10 minutes ago, Gannan said: Bay are sports talk is talking about Wiggins for Ben. Makes sense, 2 underachieving #1 picks and the salaries match. Ben would be great on that team. Play the 3 and just pass, rebound and play defense while the other guys shoot. Makes sense for the warriors and not so much for us unless you just want his contract as an expiring contract in the 22-23 offseason to make a sign and trade type move (ignore the 3 years for wiggins they haven’t updated it for 21-22 so he only has two left). I’m fine with it if you are telling me the sixers get wiggins, pascal and Minnesota’s first rounder which either conveys this year or next year. If Minnesota’s pick doesn’t convey til the 2022 draft the sixers could use that pick and wiggins as part of a deal to get a star from a rebuilding team potentially someone like Washington with beal (just saying i rather have Simmons for all his flaws then wiggins) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_hunt Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 1 hour ago, DaEagles4Life said: Embiid doesn't have years to waste and we saw what Aaron Gordon was on a good team when they have actual other talent, it wasn't pretty. this...any ben or tobi trade must be for right now help...not potential cap room or picks. embiid's legs could fall off at any time now. not interested in future cap space...at all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 31 minutes ago, mr_hunt said: this...any ben or tobi trade must be for right now help...not potential cap room or picks. embiid's legs could fall off at any time now. not interested in future cap space...at all. Here’s your problem any trade they make with them they likely aren’t getting the pieces they need to put them over the top next year. You likely are taking back a disappointment from another team that didn’t work out and likely has a bad contract that matches unless you are willing to take back expiring contracts and picks. (Unless somehow they managed to get lillard or someone of that Ilk in a trade which at the moment they have to massively overpay to have happen— like potentially maxey, thybulle and simmons with picks overpay for lillard ). Gotta hope one Gm loves Simmons, is dumb enough to actually have a uber talented player he’s willing to part with. Possible however good GMs like the warriors would likely just give you wiggins for Ben which frankly you still aren’t winning crap with wiggins even though offensively he’s better than Ben the major thing is two fold: contracts and playoff disappearances. Ben Simmons value is not great with his max contract for four more years and the same past playoff struggles showed up again this postseason. Harris has 3 years left at a near max. Imo Harris is likely easier to move for quality at the moment. However for the third consecutive playoffs when facing better competition in a series he began to fade as the series went on. The Raptors series, Celtics series he was bad (38 percent shooting both series and 27 and 13 percent from three). He was fine early in this series until the hawks made adjustments. Also guessing teams realize the hawks didn’t have their best defender (Hunter) who would’ve been guarding him all series if healthy so it could very well been worse for Harris. Their value has really been damaged over the past couple games and their contracts really don’t help matters. Hopefully game 6 and praying for game 7 they can at least somewhat change that narrative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 2 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said: Capela played 37 mins and doc didn’t get the bright idea when the hawks were on this run to hack a capela who is shooting 57% on the year and in the playoffs 9-17 for 53%. Possible disrupt their offense and they pull him out and embiid has a backup center on him. I didn't get to see the game did they at least switch to a small lineup when capela was out there and try and run him off the court? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwestbrook36 Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 3 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said: It’s so many problems. Tobias is overrated. I said at the time of the trade if Jerry west who constructed multiple championship teams and two dynasties didn’t want Harris to be part of a championship team why do you think he should with you. One of the best didn’t want him cause he didn’t believe in an all star type year he was good enough. you got Simmons debacle doc is basically Brett brown since 2013 in accomplishments the bench is still not very good and they didn’t do enough at the deadline. Yup I said the same about Tobias. Being who I am a fan of if West doesn't want you then you are not worth it. Especially as a star player. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Bwestbrook36 said: I didn't get to see the game did they at least switch to a small lineup when capela was out there and try and run him off the court? Not really. I have to go back and watch cause i don’t really remember all on court matchups throughout the games. Frankly if capela is out there and the hawks are getting hot just foul him cause it helps get them out of rhythm on offense and pull him off the floor and embiid gets an easier matchup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Bwestbrook36 said: Yup I said the same about Tobias. Being who I am a fan of if West doesn't want you then you are not worth it. Especially as a star player. Yup said the same thing at the time of the trade. If Jerry west calls you offering you something you are better off just hanging up the phone cause you aren’t going to win that trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaEagles4Life Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 1 hour ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said: Makes sense for the warriors and not so much for us unless you just want his contract as an expiring contract in the 22-23 offseason to make a sign and trade type move (ignore the 3 years for wiggins they haven’t updated it for 21-22 so he only has two left). I’m fine with it if you are telling me the sixers get wiggins, pascal and Minnesota’s first rounder which either conveys this year or next year. If Minnesota’s pick doesn’t convey til the 2022 draft the sixers could use that pick and wiggins as part of a deal to get a star from a rebuilding team potentially someone like Washington with beal (just saying i rather have Simmons for all his flaws then wiggins) We crap in Ben and rightfully so but his value is WAY beyond this. We had Harden for Ben and throw-ins if wasn't for Rockets owner holding a grudge. His value might be down right now, but he still has a ton of value at still only 24. Will definitely be teams who think they can fix him and/or think getting away from the pressure of Philly will help him. He also hasn't had a coach yet to push him, Brown pampered him and we all thought Doc was different, but nope still coddled him. I would call the Spurs and see if they will do a Dejounte Murray and Devin Vassell for Simmons. Murray, 24, a complete guard at 6'4" with 6'10" who is an excellent defender, only shot 32% from 3 last year but 37% the year before, good FT shooter at 80% which is good indicator of future shooting %, and grabbed around rebounds a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diehardfan Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 10 hours ago, Khani1 said: Ok we will see. I hope they come out and roll the next two games. My issue issues are the same ones I've had for years.... Monday happened. OK, so when it started to happen again last night not one player looked pissed off like this will not happen again. Not one player stepped up and put them on his back. Not one player looked like he could even be semi reliable in the clutch. They looked scared and shell-shocked. What did they show to say they can come back the next two games? Sure, they went up big, but they don't have the heart, passion, or will to do it. We saw that last night. That's who they are and it pisses me off to no end. I went to sleep pissed off and woke up pissed off today. Freaking disgrace. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 1 hour ago, DaEagles4Life said: We crap in Ben and rightfully so but his value is WAY beyond this. We had Harden for Ben and throw-ins if wasn't for Rockets owner holding a grudge. His value might be down right now, but he still has a ton of value at still only 24. Will definitely be teams who think they can fix him and/or think getting away from the pressure of Philly will help him. He also hasn't had a coach yet to push him, Brown pampered him and we all thought Doc was different, but nope still coddled him. I would call the Spurs and see if they will do a Dejounte Murray and Devin Vassell for Simmons. Murray, 24, a complete guard at 6'4" with 6'10" who is an excellent defender, only shot 32% from 3 last year but 37% the year before, good FT shooter at 80% which is good indicator of future shooting %, and grabbed around rebounds a game. The rockets also had only 3 teams involved in the nets, heat and sixers. So it wasn’t like the suitors out there were willing to give up more. As Miami didn’t want to give up herro in any deal. Also that deal was before another playoff performance by Simmons and it wasn’t just throw ins. it was supposedly thybulle or maxey and multiple draft picks. Got to remember the rockets were forced to trade harden at that time and there were only a few teams he’d consider going too. That scenario might not exactly present itself to get someone that great i think you are likely not getting as great of value for Ben with his Max contract being for another 4 years and the issues he has. Better than wiggins? Yes i think they could. I wouldn’t do that deal unless i got that Minnesota pick and warriors lottery pick. Even then I’d rather find another deal. i like Murray but i also don’t think he’s putting you over the top either. If I’m going to do a trade with the Spurs I’d also like to get Lonnie walker involved. I’m guessing they’d shoot that down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HazletonEagle Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 Im still thinking Sexton or Fox are the ideal trade targets for us in a Simmons trade. Hope maybe a Harris for Ingram trade can be done. A scoring guard/primarily ball handler, and a scoring wing. Team would be complete. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 9 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said: Im still thinking Sexton or Fox are the ideal trade targets for us in a Simmons trade. Hope maybe a Harris for Ingram trade can be done. A scoring guard/primarily ball handler, and a scoring wing. Team would be complete. Not sure you get Harris for ingram but I’d love for it to happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaEagles4Life Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 1 hour ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said: The rockets also had only 3 teams involved in the nets, heat and sixers. So it wasn’t like the suitors out there were willing to give up more. As Miami didn’t want to give up herro in any deal. Also that deal was before another playoff performance by Simmons and it wasn’t just throw ins. it was supposedly thybulle or maxey and multiple draft picks. Got to remember the rockets were forced to trade harden at that time and there were only a few teams he’d consider going too. That scenario might not exactly present itself to get someone that great i think you are likely not getting as great of value for Ben with his Max contract being for another 4 years and the issues he has. Better than wiggins? Yes i think they could. I wouldn’t do that deal unless i got that Minnesota pick and warriors lottery pick. Even then I’d rather find another deal. i like Murray but i also don’t think he’s putting you over the top either. If I’m going to do a trade with the Spurs I’d also like to get Lonnie walker involved. I’m guessing they’d shoot that down. Any guard that can run an offense and shoot a decent shot is better than Ben. Ben had his bags packed and was told he is getting traded until the owner said no. For Harden, Maxey and or Thybulle are throw ins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaEagles4Life Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 10 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said: Im still thinking Sexton or Fox are the ideal trade targets for us in a Simmons trade. Hope maybe a Harris for Ingram trade can be done. A scoring guard/primarily ball handler, and a scoring wing. Team would be complete. Ain't getting Harris for Ingram, come on. You still are overvaluing Harris. Sexton is a shoot first guard and doesn't even know what the word pass is or how to spell it. Can't have that with Embiid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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