18 hours ago, mattwill said:

When an audience gets larger it is going UP not DOWN. Water may be down, but the NFL’s wet dream is up.

The product quality just really suffers. Honestly should get rid of two teams in my opinion based on available talent numbers world wide. It’s good..do t get me wrong. But sure would be so much better if just bumped up 90 players or so going to 30 teams extra.

But you aren’t wrong. They’ll throw out 50 teams if it means more billions.

6 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

I was thinking the same of you. Slot CB versus Outside CB. Not hey..they’re all CBs…even though the top paid CBs are all at the same position and the Slot CBs are all under a certain ceiling. C isn’t T…even though both Oline. Slot isn’t Outside..even though both CBs. S , Slot and outside all DBs…throw out all DBs combined and just ignore his relevant the positions are forever on the NFL

How about using names instead of labels? Then you might see how they get paid accordingly

Honestly losing two teams is actually not near enough for what I’d like. Just go around the league with QBs. Not enough available. Much less actually having like the 28th best being a backup coming in.

5 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

You calling me a liar about something you couldn’t even Possibly know anything about…at all…really is character defining. But glad you identified my lie on the statement years before you were here. You are the authority about what happened on this board in 2021..for sure. What else did and didn’t happen?

You will never find anything because it's not there.

I wouldn't call you a liar , just ignorant. Which is easy to see when in your mind you get facts all wrong... Like the recent example of you stating SF making 7 nfc title games when it was 4... when you make such an egregious mistake... i.tend to lean more on ignorance than intentionally lying.

I just don’t think you pay attention to other posts because of the narcissistic nature you have.

5 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

The product quality just really suffers. Honestly should get rid of two teams in my opinion based on available talent numbers world wide. It’s good..do t get me wrong. But sure would be so much better if just bumped up 90 players or so going to 30 teams extra.

But you aren’t wrong. They’ll throw out 50 teams if it means more billions.

Get rid of 2 teams...how do you divide up the divisions and conferences now?

18 hours ago, mattwill said:

That is your opinion, it is like an a-hole … everyone has one.

Ok…so how would your opinion differ? Second best outside CB should be playing outside CB. FL says get your best players on the field. So Saquan playing DT now? If DeJean is better at Slot than Ringo outside…but Ringo better outside? Playing outside I’d want Ringo if that was the case. Can’t just broad brush better player and that just transfers seamlessly to any position.

Right now. ..Ringo is better outside. We’ll see how far DeJean progresses…but he’s behind. Carter is our best player….what fool is putting our best players out there meaning get Carter at WR?

Doesn’t work that way. Individually at specific position and role. Then there is what’s best for whole unit and team.

3 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Ok…so how would your opinion differ? Second best outside CB should be playing outside CB. FL says get your best players on the field. So Saquan playing DT now? If DeJean is better at Slot than Ringo outside…but Ringo better outside? Playing outside I’d want Ringo if that was the case. Can’t just broad brush better player and that just transfers seamlessly to any position.

Right now. ..Ringo is better outside. We’ll see how far DeJean progresses…but he’s behind. Carter is our best player….what fool is putting our best players out there meaning get Carter at WR?

Doesn’t work that way. Individually at specific position and role. Then there is what’s best for whole unit and team.

His opinion was showing the actual players and their pay... this way we can see why they make those numbers... putting name to number....not theory without the actual facts.

17 hours ago, mattwill said:

Ham, how is Hurts’ $255 million contract higher than Mahomes’ $450 million contract?

Math is definitely not your best subject.

Per year earnings? Yeah I was really good at most all subjects. English with the commas and such probably my biggest weakness…haha might have noticed. Still was always Honors English though.

Math….uhmmm just got like 110 grade in Algerbra. 115 in geometry. Trigonometry fell to 95(6). Calculus got a B. But to be fair…mostly got the B from missing homework. You wouldn’t have enjoyed a grading curve with me in your class. I missed max days too…Spanish I memorized words for the tests…got A and Bs…can speak about a dozen words now after those three years…hahaha…Hola…

Bottom line...DeJean will get paid....because of his value as a football player and his value as a cover guy. I wouldn't worry about it.

This isn't a sign of intelligence by worrying about this particular situation... it's more of a sign of a sickness. Creating problems that aren't there... like focusing on the color of napkins at a wedding. Just more of a sickness.

1 minute ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Per year earnings? Yeah I was really good at most all subjects. English with the commas and such probably my biggest weakness…haha might have noticed. Still was always Honors English though.

Math….uhmmm just got like 110 grade in Algerbra. 115 in geometry. Trigonometry fell to 95(6). Calculus got a B. But to be fair…mostly got the B from missing homework. You wouldn’t have enjoyed a grading curve with me in your class. I missed max days too…Spanish I memorized words for the tests…got A and Bs…can speak about a dozen words now after those three years…hahaha…Hola…

Need to bring up that resume... all about you...no narcissistic behavior there🙄

Apparently al these math skills and yet difficult to comprehend the difference between 4 and 7... the times SF made the playoffs the last 8 years?

Idk... maybe Spanish... Quatro o siete? Difference there is tres

🤷‍♂️

17 hours ago, GreenbleedinNC said:

Yeah I said a few posts back we seem to be shopping for a returner. IDK how MJ is as a returner or if he was used as such, conversely Robinson seems like a good returner and an iffy RB. Stay tuned

Thought we had Avery? I don’t really know him. But thought he was the guy. Maybe need to fact check me here….think so. Returner slash YAC Creation Specialist…don’t forget that key role. Saquan, Hurts, Smitty and AJ….of any D even starts jumping up after good gains YAC creating? We will destroy them!! Pretty much isolating their weakest defender in space with our supposed shiftiest hard to tackle playmaker. Dream matchup all day long…just need somebody other than Goedert.

51 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

See..on planet earth, John Lynch took over the 49ers in 2017. 8 seasons

3 of them in 4th place

2 of them in 3rd place

3 in 1st place

They did make the NFC Championship game in all 3 seasons they were in 1st place along with 2 SBs. One of the 3rd place teams got lucky playing vs Green Bay in a blizzard where the fumbled punt led to the only TD...and they went on to get smacked in the NFC title game

8 years, half of them not even making the playoffs. Constant praise... comparing those last 8 years to the Eagles is not close, yet constant complaints about each move made by Howie. " he doesn't do contracts right, he has no Cap room, even the swap of assets that ended up being better involving Pickett, Reddick/Huff moves getting us 2 picks etc...all while winning the SB.

But in your mind Lynch made 3 extra Championship games ???

Not even close....you want to compare Lynch vs the other 31 GMs... while making up fake stats...how about doing that with Howie’s actual real accomplishments?

But you can't you do that...because you would have to concede where he ranks among the other 31 GMs. Goes against the agenda.

Constant praise? I always praised Fred Warner as an absolute game changer. I years back used there example of clearing the cap…with specific note being if they can find QB. I actually see them as always flawed. Not SB champs. Maybe Purdy changes things…but he’s the best of the bunch…but not so sold on his SB quality either. So their record considering bad QB has been rare. Injuries hit them two of the down seasons. That happens. Shannahan just really can get any QB playing way above what they’d do anywhere else. But….see that’s not champion quality though. That’s overachieving but so diffficult to overcome for all the marbles. League sure is lucky Shannahan never got a great QB. He can make Mr Irrelevant look Pro Bowl worthy-ish. All scheme and playcalling. Smoke and mirrors along with physical punch you in the mouth football.

35 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

I was thinking the same of you. Slot CB versus Outside CB. Not hey..they’re all CBs…even though the top paid CBs are all at the same position and the Slot CBs are all under a certain ceiling. C isn’t T…even though both Oline. Slot isn’t Outside..even though both CBs. S , Slot and outside all DBs…throw out all DBs combined and just ignore his relevant the positions are forever on the NFL

The central question of that topic was already answered several times. You just don’t like the answer. Let me repeat that answer for you. Maybe you will hear and understand it this time.

Specifically, in a free market the buyers can choose to pay anything they want to. They look at the value they are receiving and/or will receive and then make their offer of value to the seller. Howie and Jeff will do exactly that when it is time for negotiations with DeJean and his agent, who, as the seller, will look at the value of the offer and decide if there is balance in the respective vale’s given and valued received. If there is they will accept the offer and sign the deal.

If the seller believes the value of the buyer’s offer is inadequate they will take the time to clearly describe the value that the seller has provided and/or will provide. After that recitation, they will make a counter offer.

Bottom-line, Howie and Jeff can and will do whatever they want to do in not only the DeJean negotiation, but every and all of their negotiations with two exceptions. Those two exceptions are (1) drafted rookie contracts, and (2) veteran minimum contracts. Both those exceptions are governed by a wage scale set by the NFL and the NFLPA in the Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA).

Read it and weep.

You really need to do better.

53 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

You wrote novels....I'm not going to read them...because it shows how you can't express yourself...why you would suck in a debate setting...not annihilate anyone.

This simple point isn't bad....but the easier logic and counter....is that Houston paid a top CB ...top CB money..... Stingley. Then they paid the 21st best CB.... the 21st highest money

When it comes to DeJean...he is going to get paid.

If you believe he is the top slot guy, he will be paid much more than the $13 million per in two years... if you think he is just average outside..out of 62 outside CBs... you would put him around 30th to 34 in the pay scale...much lower.

The numbers are right there. That's where it takes one post from Matt to show the numbers, but you need 37 post of theory that involves fluff that nobody is going to read... it's why your debate skills are not good. Not going to annihilate anyone in a neutral setting until you learn to be concise and you facts, like numbers and names.

Well said Joe. All Ham seems to be able to provide is hearsay.

We too have been scheming our players open so much. Almost every play our coaches call the play perfect to counter the D. Always put WR are just alone in huge space schemed to achieve excellence. Actually really sad…..I don’t know if we even get one of those plays in a game. ATL Saquan was open…but…of course that was because every football knowledgable person knew you run that ball there. We dominate rushing..but even average rushing team…you run the ball. Siri pulled out his balls on that one. Just easiest catch and game is iced.. Siri comes off as bold slamming the door shut on ATL. But instead…it actually was about the only way Siri could have given ATL a chance to win. ATL O wasn’t ever going down the field and scoring like that without the Saquan drop. Our D was shell shocked. About as obvious and bad I’ve seen that in the NFL. Other than a couple of serious injuries life threatening just completely changing every player on the field after.

52 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

You calling me a liar about something you couldn’t even Possibly know anything about…at all…really is character defining. But glad you identified my lie on the statement years before you were here. You are the authority about what happened on this board in 2021..for sure. What else did and didn’t happen?

It is easy for you to provide the Court with evidence of what you say. I am just a spectator in the courtroom. Nothing more, nothing less.

1 hour ago, mattwill said:

You again show your ignorance of what a "wage scale” is. A wage scale sets the wages of all the covered employees based on a rigid published list of pay grades and amounts for each grade. There is no free market. Everything is predetermined, typically based on tenure (time in the industry). The NFL’s minimum salary is governed by a wage scale.

"The NFL minimum salary varies based on a player's years of experience. For the 2024 season, the minimum salary is $915,000 for players with 1 year of experience, $985,000 for 2 years, $1,055,000 for 3 years, and $1,125,000 for players with 4-6 years of experience. Players with 7 or more years of experience earn a minimum of $1,21 million. ”

You really need to make a better effort.

This fits for the vet minimum…but no free market? Free Agents do what? I’m not claiming to be any expert on the differences here technically. But..you didn’t make a good point in your attempt either. Rookie wages fit for you also. But everything else is free market….minus the tags…any player reaches free agency can sign with the highest bidder or best choice situation overall. Which…teams all pay according to position. So wage scale by position seems like a good way for it to be described. Outside Cb wage…then way below is Slot CB wage. Ceedy Duce can want S money as a Slot in New Orleans…but not one team paid the Slot S money. They don’t do it.

We’ll see Slot on O and D progress. Held back by old school thinking really. 90’s(pick a decade) football philosophy and previous dug that hole. I dont doubt for a second those two positions will see boosts before too long. Some ways O and D can work better with top Slot players. The difference in a Maddox getting toasted in the slot always. But…D minds pretty old school.

We should see recognizing a dime S position here coming. Just being utilized as the second most used personnel package league wide. It’s the Slot CB…like it was 30 years ago.

3 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

So wage scale by position seems like a good way for it to be described.

You may think/believe it is a good way for it to be described, but it is a false and inaccurate way for it to be described.

Think of it this way, someone reading your posts in this forum may believe that Mork from Ork is a good way to describe you. Does the fact that they believe that make it either true or accurate?

7 minutes ago, mattwill said:

You may think/believe it is a good way for it to be described, but it is a false and inaccurate way for it to be described.

Think of it this way, someone reading your posts in this forum may believe that Mork from Ork is a good way to describe you. Does the fact that they believe that make it either true or accurate?

Like I said…I don’t stake any claims to be any expert on the subject. I could look into it. I prefer to really form conclusions based on gathering enough information to do so. How I believed it was viewed. Not even say I’m wrong…just not going to pretend I’m 100 percent confident. Actually thought I helped you out there with what you were saying.

Exclusively 32 teams in the closed NFL league system, I believe technically changes whether it could be considered a free market.

1 hour ago, joemas6 said:

You will never find anything because it's not there.

I wouldn't call you a liar , just ignorant. Which is easy to see when in your mind you get facts all wrong... Like the recent example of you stating SF making 7 nfc title games when it was 4... when you make such an egregious mistake... i.tend to lean more on ignorance than intentionally lying.

I just don’t think you pay attention to other posts because of the narcissistic nature you have.

Yeah I admit exaggerating Niners run there. But was still pretty impressive whole organization compared to most any other teams. Not us and the Chiefs. But easy to say 25 other teams Weren’t as good as the Niners there. Just threw out random number seemed close. So no…I’m not technically going v through team by team last several years accomplishments.

The goal is win championships. On that don’t think Lynch did his job. Flawed team…hard to say just how far the not winning a championship characteristics are embedded there. Lynch…might be one isn’t doing it. Shannahan could make a case against him. Of course the case for such overachieving overcoming the QB he’s clearly displayed beyond question.

But is a trait of getting the best out of a QB that can’t win a championship a great skill? It’s useful…but ceiling of your Bronze Standard.