Jalen Hurts - shoulder sprain injury; expected for playoffs

[EazyEaglez]

Maybe it’s best not to be so hasty to go quarterback hunting so soon. Build the roster up with young talented players first and see what you have in Hurts.

[Swoop]

52 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

 

Isn’t he still under contract with the Colts?

Pretty sure he signed a 2 year deal before the 2019 season. I'd have to look, but I'm almost positive he's a FA.

[EazyEaglez]

4 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Pretty sure he signed a 2 year deal before the 2019 season. I'd have to look, but I'm almost positive he's a FA.

Just looked it up and he is a UFA. If he’s the option it wouldn’t bother me. 

[Outlaw]

37 minutes ago, MidMoFo said:

I think it would be a good move. See if our new coaching staff can build an offense to fit two qbs with similar skill sets.

I’d rather go with Brissett. 

[UK_EaglesFan89]

9 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

Personally I think the Eagles need to focus more on building a strong roster than spending too many resources on one quarterback. 

I agree there. This roster is too old and just not good enough at this point. It needs a lot of young talent and I think they can really focus on a rebuild. If the right QB falls to them this year, or they love a guy this year or next or the year after then by all means go for it but don't force it. 

[EazyEaglez]

2 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I agree there. This roster is too old and just not good enough at this point. It needs a lot of young talent and I think they can really focus on a rebuild. If the right QB falls to them this year, or they love a guy this year or next or the year after then by all means go for it but don't force it. 

These people lamenting that we need another franchise quarterback don’t seem to realize we would just be walking down the same path we just left. The Eagles paid their franchise quarterback and have been 12-15-1 with him since that point. They have been 17-21-1 with him since the Super Bowl season. Why is that good? Why are people rushing for more of that? Build this roster up and that’s something that could not happen with Carson’s enormous contract and subpar play. By 2022 the Eagles could potentially have 3 first round picks and a boatload of cap space. That’s a lot of possibilities to build up a talented roster. Chasing the next Carson Wentz could net you the next Carson Wentz and frankly that’s not all that special. 

[UK_EaglesFan89]

27 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

These people lamenting that we need another franchise quarterback don’t seem to realize we would just be walking down the same path we just left. The Eagles paid their franchise quarterback and have been 12-15-1 with him since that point. They have been 17-21-1 with him since the Super Bowl season. Why is that good? Why are people rushing for more of that? Build this roster up and that’s something that could not happen with Carson’s enormous contract and subpar play. By 2022 the Eagles could potentially have 3 first round picks and a boatload of cap space. That’s a lot of possibilities to build up a talented roster. Chasing the next Carson Wentz could net you the next Carson Wentz and frankly that’s not all that special. 

I agree with you. Look Carson leaves Philly 35-32-1. Why? Well a lot of that is because the roster around him simply was not good enough. So lets build up this roster, get younger and then address the QB position further down the line.

[Swoop]

1 hour ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I agree with you. Look Carson leaves Philly 35-32-1. Why? Well a lot of that is because the roster around him simply was not good enough. So lets build up this roster, get younger and then address the QB position further down the line.

There's another side to that, though. 

Suppose you build the roster up with loads of young talent and form a pretty good team aside from the QB. I'm not against that at all and think it's fine. It's a risk though.

Should you build the roster up and address the QB position down the road 3/4 years, you need to pray you hit on a guy. If you don't, you're going to have the rest of the team leaving via FA, wanting new deals and then at that point getting a little long in the tooth.

For example, suppose the average age of the roster is 28 when you draft the QB of the future. If he ends up not being the guy, suddenly the average age of the roster is in the 30s and you need to find a QB quick or start over.

Look at teams like the Bears or Vikings. Fringe playoff teams with talent on both sides of the ball that are going to waste because they can't find a QB.

I'm not saying building the roster first is the wrong decision or that I'm against that, because I'm not. I'm merely playing devil's advocate.

[Infam]

43 minutes ago, Swoop said:

There's another side to that, though. 

Suppose you build the roster up with loads of young talent and form a pretty good team aside from the QB. I'm not against that at all and think it's fine. It's a risk though.

Should you build the roster up and address the QB position down the road 3/4 years, you need to pray you hit on a guy. If you don't, you're going to have the rest of the team leaving via FA, wanting new deals and then at that point getting a little long in the tooth.

For example, suppose the average age of the roster is 28 when you draft the QB of the future. If he ends up not being the guy, suddenly the average age of the roster is in the 30s and you need to find a QB quick or start over.

Look at teams like the Bears or Vikings. Fringe playoff teams with talent on both sides of the ball that are going to waste because they can't find a QB.

I'm not saying building the roster first is the wrong decision or that I'm against that, because I'm not. I'm merely playing devil's advocate.

No need to draft a QB as we already have a franchise QB. Lets build around him.

[UK_EaglesFan89]

40 minutes ago, Swoop said:

Should you build the roster up and address the QB position down the road 3/4 years, you need to pray you hit on a guy. If you don't, you're going to have the rest of the team leaving via FA, wanting new deals and then at that point getting a little long in the tooth.

For example, suppose the average age of the roster is 28 when you draft the QB of the future. If he ends up not being the guy, suddenly the average age of the roster is in the 30s and you need to find a QB quick or start over.

And so I think the answer lies somewhere in the middle. Look if a QB they love falls to them at #6 this year then they should consider pulling the trigger but I also think they should be open minded to going in to next year with Hurts and seeing how that plays out. Same applies next year in the draft, if this team is as bad as many of us think it will be then they will be drafting high again next year...

I think they need to strike the right balance and I absolutely agree they can't build the entire roster and in 3-4 years time try to get the right QB because that then means they have to get the pick / move right. But they could look at things year by year for the next 2-3 years and perhaps bide their time.

[Swoop]

2 minutes ago, Infam said:

No need to draft a QB, as we already have a franchise QB. Lets build around him.

Going to agree to disagree.

[EazyEaglez]

32 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

And so I think the answer lies somewhere in the middle. Look if a QB they love falls to them at #6 this year then they should consider pulling the trigger but I also think they should be open minded to going in to next year with Hurts and seeing how that plays out. Same applies next year in the draft, if this team is as bad as many of us think it will be then they will be drafting high again next year...

I think they need to strike the right balance and I absolutely agree they can't build the entire roster and in 3-4 years time try to get the right QB because that then means they have to get the pick / move right. But they could look at things year by year for the next 2-3 years and perhaps bide their time.

Not to mention that Howie will have possibly two first round picks and a boatload of cap space. We have already saw quarterbacks move around. We saw Brady go to Tampa and lead them to a Super Bowl. I’m sure Tampa is happier with that SB trophy than spinning their wheels with another year trying to figure out how to win with their "Franchise Quarterback” Jaimis Winston. 

[brkmsn]

Every year the draft's top QB prospects get overrated and drafted above where they should go on day 1. I think when you draft a (QB)  prospect on day 2, you are getting a guy that is less splashy, but more realistically drafted according to his projection.

The investment in Hurts was significant enough to really commit to his development moving forward. Drafting another overrated prospect at #6 wouldn't answer in questions and would only add to them. 

[greend]

I don't think Hurts is the answer, but he has to be given his chance since he was drafted because Howie thinks he's Russel Wilson IIII.  But all bets are off in the draft because HOWIE

[UK_EaglesFan89]

30 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

Not to mention that Howie will have possibly two first round picks and a boatload of cap space. We have already saw quarterbacks move around. We saw Brady go to Tampa and lead them to a Super Bowl. I’m sure Tampa is happier with that SB trophy than spinning their wheels with another year trying to figure out how to win with their "Franchise Quarterback” Jaimis Winston. 

But I would say here... Those 2 first round picks next year shouldn't necessarily be packaged together to move up (if needed) to get a QB. I'd rather they use those picks on acquiring young talent to build this roster. Unless of course they love a particular QB.

[Bamabird]

14 hours ago, kentwo said:

There are huge problems with that mindset.

Hurts does not look like a franchise QB, but they should give him a chance BUT if he doesn't work out. The team will be left scrambling for a QB in next year's draft which looks to be weak at the position. This year's QB class is pretty strong at the top and the team has the opportunity to get one of them. If they wait, they will most likely have to trade up to "settle" and reach for someone next year in a weak QB class. That's going to set the entire team back another 3-5 years.

Too bad next year's QBs won't be at the level of this year's class.

Next year's class is looking much stronger at this time than this class looked.

Let's be honest, besides Lawrence and Fields who was anyone talking about at the start of the season?  Mac Jones and Kyle Trask had break out years. Trey Lance had a great year in 2019, but only played 1 game in 2020.I will say Zach Wilson has had a solid career, not a break out career or even a break out year, but a very solid college career.

I don't think there is any way to judge next years class overall, there are some studs to be on the look out for, Daniels out of AZ State, Slovis out of USC and Rattler out of OK.

[EazyEaglez]

17 minutes ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

But I would say here... Those 2 first round picks next year shouldn't necessarily be packaged together to move up (if needed) to get a QB. I'd rather they use those picks on acquiring young talent to build this roster. Unless of course they love a particular QB.

Those two picks do not necessarily need to be used to move up and get a rookie quarterback. They could use them to trade for a guy in the league or just use them to draft more talent. The point is a team that looked like it had little to no options after this season is open to several by 2022. 

[Guest]

15 hours ago, Next_Up said:

Agreed although I would take the best OL at 6. Rebuild should start with the lines, IMO.

Yep.  Sewell is a generational tackle.  If he falls you take him, and see what you can get for Dillard and/or Mailata.

[kentwo]

3 hours ago, Bamabird said:

Next year's class is looking much stronger at this time than this class looked.

Let's be honest, besides Lawrence and Fields who was anyone talking about at the start of the season?  Mac Jones and Kyle Trask had break out years. Trey Lance had a great year in 2019, but only played 1 game in 2020.I will say Zach Wilson has had a solid career, not a break out career or even a break out year, but a very solid college career.

I don't think there is any way to judge next years class overall, there are some studs to be on the look out for, Daniels out of AZ State, Slovis out of USC and Rattler out of OK.

I don't think it looks stronger, maybe deeper. Definitely way more question marks and potential reaches.

A lot of the top prospects are unknowns. Slovis didn't produce as expected and threw a ton of picks. A few of the other top guys are backups that might have potential, but not performance yet. Bryce Young behind Jones. Uiagalelei behind Lawrence. Rattler is in the mold of undersized QB who doesn't have the running skills that Hurts or Mayfield while playing as a "system" QB. Howell might be the top guy, but he's another 6'1 QB that puts up a lot of stats, but not in the SEC. Daniels had under 60% completion and is around 180 lbs.

Sure, some of these guys will take the next step, but no one in the crop is at the Lawrence or Fields level at this point in their career. Wilson threw for 33 TDs and 3 INTs that's pretty good for a college year. He's one of those guys that worked his way up every year. Lance's 2019 year was basically his 2020 year, just like J.Chase P.Sewell and the other opt outs treat it.

The point is, QB is such an important position that if there is a guy you feel is the franchise guy you have to spend to get him. It is too important to play what if's. Unless the organization really doesn't think Wilson or Fields (not counting Lawrence as they have no shot at him) are NFL guys then they can wait, but next year's top guys have way more question marks that this year's top QBs have. Not to mention the team may not even be drafting this high next season, which means they'd have to trade up to get someone rather than potentially staying at six this year and having Fields or Wilson fall to them.

 

[Bamabird]

8 minutes ago, kentwo said:

I don't think it looks stronger, maybe deeper. Definitely way more question marks and potential reaches.

A lot of the top prospects are unknowns. Slovis didn't produce as expected and threw a ton of picks. A few of the other top guys are backups that might have potential, but not performance yet. Bryce Young behind Jones. Uiagalelei behind Lawrence. Rattler is in the mold of undersized QB who doesn't have the running skills that Hurts or Mayfield while playing as a "system" QB. Howell might be the top guy, but he's another 6'1 QB that puts up a lot of stats, but not in the SEC. Daniels had under 60% completion and is around 180 lbs.

Sure, some of these guys will take the next step, but no one in the crop is at the Lawrence or Fields level at this point in their career. Wilson threw for 33 TDs and 3 INTs that's pretty good for a college year. He's one of those guys that worked his way up every year. Lance's 2019 year was basically his 2020 year, just like J.Chase P.Sewell and the other opt outs treat it.

The point is, QB is such an important position that if there is a guy you feel is the franchise guy you have to spend to get him. It is too important to play what if's. Unless the organization really doesn't think Wilson or Fields (not counting Lawrence as they have no shot at him) are NFL guys then they can wait, but next year's top guys have way more question marks that this year's top QBs have. Not to mention the team may not even be drafting this high next season, which means they'd have to trade up to get someone rather than potentially staying at six this year and having Fields or Wilson fall to them.

 

I would say you have to give these guys their 3rd or 4th years, that's when most of them really shine. Look at Burrows, he was lost until his final year at LSU!

I would be reluctant to prop up Fields, JMHO. He only had 1 really good game last year against a really good team. He played his heart out against Clemson, but the revenge factor can't be outlooked, especially in college football.  The Big Ten was really a train wreck last year, the teams that were supposed to be good were awful! I think he could have benefited from playing another year. 

After what Brees, Wilson and Mayfield have done as QBs, I don't count undersized QBs without another factor. I think both Fields and Wilson will be there at 6, there is this idea that the Falcons, my home town team, are looking for a QB at 4, but the new coach seems more like a guy to build a team with a good running game. I think they trade down and pick up a RB and a CB in the 1st.

[kentwo]

6 minutes ago, Bamabird said:

I would say you have to give these guys their 3rd or 4th years, that's when most of them really shine. Look at Burrows, he was lost until his final year at LSU!

I would be reluctant to prop up Fields, JMHO. He only had 1 really good game last year against a really good team. He played his heart out against Clemson, but the revenge factor can't be outlooked, especially in college football.  The Big Ten was really a train wreck last year, the teams that were supposed to be good were awful! I think he could have benefited from playing another year. 

After what Brees, Wilson and Mayfield have done as QBs, I don't count undersized QBs without another factor. I think both Fields and Wilson will be there at 6, there is this idea that the Falcons, my home town team, are looking for a QB at 4, but the new coach seems more like a guy to build a team with a good running game. I think they trade down and pick up a RB and a CB in the 1st.

 

I don't count Mayfield in that really successful undersized QB group. He doesn't carry his team as much as manage his team while surrounded by a great running game. So other than Brees and Wilson, there haven't been many undersized QBs with long term success in the NFL. I think the Jets may take one after they get rid of Darnold. Also, the Falcons aren't in as much a need as some other teams, but like the Eagles if they really like Fields or Wilson this may be their only change to get a guy of that level without doing a total rebuild. This is a good year for a team like the Falcons to trade down with other teams that are only a QB away from contending. I honestly don't think either Fields or Wilson (possibly both) will be there at six. There are few young high end franchise QBs and teams are starting to look for their aging replacements. If the Falcons or Jets trade down it will be to teams that want a QB.

[vaeagle2]

IMO  go with hurts , draft pitts if there at 6 , the team can use a move the chains style offense with the run game and medium to short pass game with a deep ball now and then. with the wr's and te's the team has they should score on anyone when the oline is healthy. the defensive coaches and scheme should help the secondary and there is no reason they can't win this up and down division.

[NOTW]

18 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

Maybe it’s best not to be so hasty to go quarterback hunting so soon. Build the roster up with young talented players first and see what you have in Hurts.

Putting aside Howie's bad drafting for a moment, the best thing to do in a true rebuild with that high of a pick is to take the guy you think has the best chance of being a real difference maker, a real franchise player you can't live without for 10 years.  If your choice is a QB who will be pretty good but pass on a potential HOF player at another position then I think you take the guy you think will be that HOF player.  

People every year say this is the year to get a QB, that next year's class is no good.  Then you have QBs that by next year's draft time are top prospects, you also have guys in the 2nd round and later that can turn out to be good.  Then you have Goff and Wentz who went 1 and 2 and both were traded away.  So you never know.  I tend to agree with you, build up the team around Hurts and if he's not the answer move on later.  

[UK_EaglesFan89]

Just now, NOTW said:

Putting aside Howie's bad drafting for a moment, the best thing to do in a true rebuild with that high of a pick is to take the guy you think has the best chance of being a real difference maker, a real franchise player you can't live without for 10 years.  If your choice is a QB who will be pretty good but pass on a potential HOF player at another position then I think you take the guy you think will be that HOF player.  

People every year say this is the year to get a QB, that next year's class is no good.  Then you have QBs that by next year's draft time are top prospects, you also have guys in the 2nd round and later that can turn out to be good.  Then you have Goff and Wentz who went 1 and 2 and both were traded away.  So you never know.  I tend to agree with you, build up the team around Hurts and if he's not the answer move on later.  

The reality is QB is the biggest crap shoot. Like who thought Mahomes was going to be as good as he's been. So much comes down to scheme, fit, weapons, coaching etc. So I agree let's build up a roster around genuine difference makers regardless of position. I mean the Eagles have overlooked LB for a long time now... Tampa's LBs were pretty damn disruptive this past year though. Top franchise changing guys will change the teams direction almost irrespective of what position they play. 

[QBhunter58]

1 minute ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

The reality is QB is the biggest crap shoot. Like who thought Mahomes was going to be as good as he's been. So much comes down to scheme, fit, weapons, coaching etc. So I agree let's build up a roster around genuine difference makers regardless of position. I mean the Eagles have overlooked LB for a long time now... Tampa's LBs were pretty damn disruptive this past year though. Top franchise changing guys will change the teams direction almost irrespective of what position they play. 

Gruden was really big on Mahomes, he said he was going to be a generational guy based on the skills he had and his profile. Its as much about the tools as it is about scheme, fit, weapons, coaching, etc. All are important, but the thing is, every coach thinks they have a great scheme and coaching... this is why they stress the tools so much.