Time to put Howie back in the basement? - Discuss Howie Roseman here

[Sturm]

14 minutes ago, Random Reglar said:

 
So you think that winning a Super Bowl is a negative?  It would've been better if the Eagles DIDN'T win a Super Bowl?

Winning a Super Bowl was so far outside of the realm of possibility, that the only fans left were the ones who didn't want a Super Bowl win,  the half a century of not winning a Super Bowl drove away all fans who wanted a Super Bowl win, and the Eagles were only left with fans who prefer complaining to winning, so that when the Super Bowl win did come,  the fans actually didn't really appreciate it, and it certainly didn't change their perspective of the Eagles as a team that sucks and they just like to complain about them.

Sorta like music these days,  we have to fill time with something and complaining about garbage music is, I guess, as good as anything else to complain about.

But again,  the Eagles did just win a Super Bowl. 

We didn't "just" win. That would be Bucks who "just" won.

We chased out Doggie for being a bad coach. Now its time to move on from Howie. He struck lightning in a bottle.

We all know who the real hero of the Superbowl was.

BDN.

[NOTW]

The face that is responsible for the rebuild:

 

[Bwestbrook36]

1 hour ago, NOTW said:

The face that is responsible for the rebuild:

 

And my nightmares

[NOTW]

22 hours ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

And my nightmares

Just wait til he gets cute at #6! 😱

[PoconoDon]

21 hours ago, NOTW said:

Just wait til he gets cute at #6! 😱

Howie getting cute on draft day again?????

Every Eagles fan reaction at #6:

Spoiler

 

[jsdarkstar]

This season is going to be a total disaster.  

• 3-13. Ugggh. 

[EazyEaglez]

4 hours ago, jsdarkstar said:

This season is going to be a total disaster.  

• 3-13. Ugggh. 

Is that any different from the 4-12 we saw last season? 😂 My only hope is Andy Reid went 4-12 his final year as HC here. That team had a host of injuries (like this one) and a lame duck coach (like this one) and the following year Kelly won 10 games and made the playoffs. If Sirianni can coach things might not be so bad. They’re still in the NFC Least mind you. 

[jsdarkstar]

6 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

Is that any different from the 4-12 we saw last season? 😂 My only hope is Andy Reid went 4-12 his final year as HC here. That team had a host of injuries (like this one) and a lame duck coach (like this one) and the following year Kelly won 10 games and made the playoffs. If Sirianni can coach things might not be so bad. They’re still in the NFC Least mind you. 

The teams in the East are all getting better while this team is getting worse. Can Sirianni Coach? I guess we shall see.

[EazyEaglez]

2 hours ago, jsdarkstar said:

The teams in the East are all getting better while this team is getting worse. Can Sirianni Coach? I guess we shall see.

I really do hope he can coach. Major setback if he can’t.

[Cochis_Calhoun]

On 3/21/2021 at 6:08 AM, EazyEaglez said:

Is that any different from the 4-12 we saw last season? 😂 My only hope is Andy Reid went 4-12 his final year as HC here. That team had a host of injuries (like this one) and a lame duck coach (like this one) and the following year Kelly won 10 games and made the playoffs. If Sirianni can coach things might not be so bad. They’re still in the NFC Least mind you. 

Some of Reid's roster is still under contract, that's why this won't be a quick recovery, if Sirianni pulls 10 wins out next season we've got another cliff edge coming when Lane, Kelce, Graham and Fletch all hang them up in consecutive seasons unless Howie learns how to put together a scouting operation and not outdraft himself.

[macgregor]

On 4/23/2020 at 11:40 PM, ToDie4Eagles said:

Haha ofcourse.  It's NEVER Howie's fault.  If he botches this draft again, it will go back to..."Howie's a numbers guy. He needs a football guy to help him with the draft!" Then we hire Joe Douglas 2.0 again and the cycle repeats itself.

I'm the only person saying everything isn't Howie's fault. Everyone else is saying what you're saying(especially the media). I'll go back to saying what I posted before. 7 seasons with complete  personnel control. 4 winning seasons, 3 in the playoffs, one super bowl win. He's made mistakes, but gets blamed for many more than he commits. And the mistakes he made, like trading up to draft Carson Wentz, and then extending him on less than a complete evaluation; I supported at the time and now won't hypocritically blame him for now that I have the advantage of 20/20 hindsight.

I hate the expression 'Howie isn't a football guy' because I know what it means; and it has nothing to do with football knowledge.

[beto_eagles]

On 3/20/2021 at 7:21 PM, jsdarkstar said:

This season is going to be a total disaster.  

• 3-13. Ugggh. 

3-14*

[EazyEaglez]

On 3/22/2021 at 12:33 PM, Cochis_Calhoun said:

Some of Reid's roster is still under contract, that's why this won't be a quick recovery, if Sirianni pulls 10 wins out next season we've got another cliff edge coming when Lane, Kelce, Graham and Fletch all hang them up in consecutive seasons unless Howie learns how to put together a scouting operation and not outdraft himself.

Howie seems to misunderstand the importance of the draft. He wastes top draftpicks on developmental type projects. First round picks should be starters. 2nd and 3rd round picks should be major contributors if not starters. Just feels like here these guys need tears (some after their first contracts are up) for any of them to actually develop. Seems like every time a draft is deep at a position Howie always selects the wrong guy too. Still if Sirianni can coach and is able to get the best out of the talent he has the team will be better. I can’t say for how long though. Like you mentioned Howie is still paying Reid guys who are clearly slowing down. 

[NOTW]

On paper it's a good deal, and with a competent GM who can draft well it would help build the team with solid talent. 

I just have a hard time missing out on potential stud players because after the top 10 Howie isn't good. He will draft an ok player or a JAG. 

Howie needs a high pick that's more of a "no brainer" pick. 

He is more interested in trades and draft capital, and Lurie will think this is genius. But they need this year and next year's 1st round picks to be GREAT, not just JAGs.

Will Howie make truly GREAT draft picks?

History says NO. 

[TEW]

2 hours ago, NOTW said:

On paper it's a good deal, and with a competent GM who can draft well it would help build the team with solid talent. 

I just have a hard time missing out on potential stud players because after the top 10 Howie isn't good. He will draft an ok player or a JAG. 

Howie needs a high pick that's more of a "no brainer" pick. 

He is more interested in trades and draft capital, and Lurie will think this is genius. But they need this year and next year's 1st round picks to be GREAT, not just JAGs.

Will Howie make truly GREAT draft picks?

History says NO. 

History says no GM, even HOF type GMs, are likely to make "truly GREAT draft picks."

Most of the great GMs basically have an above average record over a long period, but the distribution of their good draft picks gets concentrated in a compressed time frame to create an excellent team from which their reputation is built.

Howie has had 3 picks in the 10-15 range -- Graham, Cox and Barnett. One guy with HOF potential, one guy who is a decade long starter that made a pro bowl and all pro team, and another guy who is an average starter.  So going by that record, we're most likely looking at a long term starter who makes a couple of pro bowls.  That's a pretty darn good expected value.

[EazyEaglez]

Howie took a team from SB champs to the worst team in the worst division in football. It’s time to end this.

[NOTW]

1 hour ago, TEW said:

History says no GM, even HOF type GMs, are likely to make "truly GREAT draft picks."

Most of the great GMs basically have an above average record over a long period, but the distribution of their good draft picks gets concentrated in a compressed time frame to create an excellent team from which their reputation is built.

Howie has had 3 picks in the 10-15 range -- Graham, Cox and Barnett. One guy with HOF potential, one guy who is a decade long starter that made a pro bowl and all pro team, and another guy who is an average starter.  So going by that record, we're most likely looking at a long term starter who makes a couple of pro bowls.  That's a pretty darn good expected value.

Reid picked Cox and Graham.

[Bwestbrook36]

1 hour ago, NOTW said:

Reid picked Cox and Graham.

You know you could  say roseman was only the GM and had final say on picks for 4 seasons 1 of which he won a super bowl. Because technically they have Roseman as only an advisor to Kelly his entire tenure here and kelly always had final say on the roster. So technically he has had only 3 bad seasons. 

[TEW]

2 hours ago, NOTW said:

Reid picked Cox and Graham.

Howie was the GM. You don't think he had anything to do with the decision?

This idea that any draft pick is 100% the responsibility of a single person is retarded.

Scouts go and watch the players for the entire college football season. They pass reports up the chain. Meanwhile you have everyone from private investigators to doctors looking into the player's background. Before it gets to Reid, or Howie, or any of the people you've actually heard of, there are probably a dozen people who have looked at a player and recommended them.

From there you get the GM, the HC, the coordinator, the position coach, maybe the owner, etc to take a look. Then they get together and come to a consensus. 

[EaglesfanfromND]

On 3/27/2021 at 6:18 PM, TEW said:

Howie was the GM. You don't think he had anything to do with the decision?

This idea that any draft pick is 100% the responsibility of a single person is retarded.

Scouts go and watch the players for the entire college football season. They pass reports up the chain. Meanwhile you have everyone from private investigators to doctors looking into the player's background. Before it gets to Reid, or Howie, or any of the people you've actually heard of, there are probably a dozen people who have looked at a player and recommended them.

From there you get the GM, the HC, the coordinator, the position coach, maybe the owner, etc to take a look. Then they get together and come to a consensus. 

And then the GM makes the pick and sometimes it goes against the consensus. Kind of like Reagor over Jefferson or drafting a backup QB in the second round when you have multiple starting position needs to fill or improve. Someone has the final say and it's the guy making the pick. And even if it is a complete consensus and it's still a terrible result the GM is ultimately responsible because he put all of those people in those positions to begin with so the bottom line is it comes down to that one person making terrible decisions.

[EazyEaglez]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/nick-sirianni-unlock-eagles-wr-161610253.html
 

Wasn’t the reason we were told they didn’t draft Jefferson was cause they thought he could only play in the slot? Now the plan is to use Reagor there? Heck Reagor could barely remember his outside routes and most of the time he ren lazy routes, but now he’s going to be trusted to learn more? Nice job Howie. 

[Bwestbrook36]

52 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said:

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/nick-sirianni-unlock-eagles-wr-161610253.html
 

Wasn’t the reason we were told they didn’t draft Jefferson was cause they thought he could only play in the slot? Now the plan is to use Reagor there? Heck Reagor could barely remember his outside routes and most of the time he ren lazy routes, but now he’s going to be trusted to learn more? Nice job Howie. 

Well different coaches, maybe they see something there more. I still think Reagor will turn out good. Most people were crying over Lamb not Jefferson but that is what fans do pretend they wanted someone else after the fact. 

[Infam]

On 3/22/2021 at 6:30 PM, macgregor said:

I'm the only person saying everything isn't Howie's fault.

No, you're not.

 

[Cochis_Calhoun]

On 3/27/2021 at 10:40 PM, Bwestbrook36 said:

You know you could  say roseman was only the GM and had final say on picks for 4 seasons 1 of which he won a super bowl. Because technically they have Roseman as only an advisor to Kelly his entire tenure here and kelly always had final say on the roster. So technically he has had only 3 bad seasons. 

What are you talking about, Kelly had full control for one draft 2015, even Howie admits Marcus Smith in 2014 was his pick, Chip had one draft and in the first 3 rounds picked players who are still starting in the NFL in Agholor, Rowe and Hicks.

In fact saying Howie didn't have much input into Kelly's drafts makes him even worse, because the '13 draft is by a country mile the best of Howie's career, so if that was all Chipper then we should have kept him as GM because he picked more talent in 3 drafts than Howie's managed his entire GM career.

[Bwestbrook36]

5 minutes ago, Cochis_Calhoun said:

What are you talking about, Kelly had full control for one draft 2015, even Howie admits Marcus Smith in 2014 was his pick, Chip had one draft and in the first 3 rounds picked players who are still starting in the NFL in Agholor, Rowe and Hicks.

In fact saying Howie didn't have much input into Kelly's drafts makes him even worse, because the '13 draft is by a country mile the best of Howie's career, so if that was all Chipper then we should have kept him as GM because he picked more talent in 3 drafts than Howie's managed his entire GM career.

This is true, they say Howie was only an advisor to chip like he was to Reid. 

So if this is true I don't know why Howie would admit Marcus Smith was his pick... Maybe to make it look like he was being humble and was able to reflect on poor choices to the fans or whoever who knows.

There is also a rumor that chip tore up all of the scouting reports and all the work the scouts did and wanted his guys and his picks going into the Marcus Smith draft and that is why chip got complete control with his guys his last year