Time to put Howie back in the basement? - Discuss Howie Roseman here

[EazyEaglez]

When it comes to Wentz being traded let’s be clear. Wentz wanted out. Howie didn’t have the foresight to see Wentz should go. I can give Howie credit for holding out for his 1st, and drafting Hurts, but even the pick of Hurts was directly related to Wentz getting hurt in the playoff. On a side note this idea that the line and coaching are what led to Wentz and his demise is a load of crap. Carson has consistently been in the 30 plus sack range for most of his career. Last season he jumped up to 50. The same squad had 26 with Hurts, and that was with several players out at various times to various reasons. Wentz once again is in the 30s for sacks. That was a group that only gave up 19 with Rivers. I also find it funny how people want to say Wentz got bad coaching from basically coaches who won without him. 

[time2rock]

21 minutes ago, Traveler Vic said:

In light of Wentz chocking..many Philadelphia newspapers point out how smart was Howie, in Getting rid of Wentz. I am not going to argue the obvious that Wentz had to go...but I do not think that smart had anything to do with it. Wentz departure was precipitated by an NFL Record worst offensive line, and bad coaching. Wentz certainly played a large part in his downfall. Howie only did the obvious and recouped some of the lost capital. The 3rd was traded to move up for Smith in this 2021 years draft, and that certainly worked out. Howie does get points for that. Next year we will have probably an 18th pick from the Colts as well. For next year...I do not hold my breath in thinking that all of the sudden Howie became prophet draft guru. I fully expect him to screw up in the next year's draft, because at the end of the day he is an average GM with some wins and some misses. But like the ending of "Ratatouille", a kid inside of me is waiting for the next year's draft, and says: "Surprise me!" 

 

I think you might mean this year?  If so, that pick is #16.  

[Bwestbrook36]

This is what we needed! A Wentz thread disguised as a Howie thread!

[EagleJoe8]

5 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

This is what we needed! A Wentz thread disguised as a Howie thread!

Right?!?!

 

 

So anyway, Wentz or Foles??

 

 

[Moderator6]

36 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said:

This is what we needed! A Wentz thread disguised as a Howie thread!

Or is it a Howie thread disguised as a Wentz thread?  

Either way it's being merged. 

[Traveler Vic]

11 hours ago, Moderator6 said:

Or is it a Howie thread disguised as a Wentz thread?  

Either way it's being merged. 

Blatant failure of Democracy and free speech. LOL

[D-Shiznit]

14 hours ago, EazyEaglez said:

When it comes to Wentz being traded let’s be clear. Wentz wanted out. Howie didn’t have the foresight to see Wentz should go. I can give Howie credit for holding out for his 1st, and drafting Hurts, but even the pick of Hurts was directly related to Wentz getting hurt in the playoff. On a side note this idea that the line and coaching are what led to Wentz and his demise is a load of crap. Carson has consistently been in the 30 plus sack range for most of his career. Last season he jumped up to 50. The same squad had 26 with Hurts, and that was with several players out at various times to various reasons. Wentz once again is in the 30s for sacks. That was a group that only gave up 19 with Rivers. I also find it funny how people want to say Wentz got bad coaching from basically coaches who won without him. 

Yeah, can't give Howie credit for having any sort of foresight to trade Wentz. His hand was forced by Carson.

However, as you said, he did fleece Ballard in the trade, bad. Howie knew Reich wanted Wentz badly and used it to swindle a 1st round pick.

Colts were bidding against themselves once Chicago bowed out, and Howie still somehow manged to pull out a 1st + change. Respect.

[EazyEaglez]

2 hours ago, D-Shiznit said:

Yeah, can't give Howie credit for having any sort of foresight to trade Wentz. His hand was forced by Carson.

However, as you said, he did fleece Ballard in the trade, bad. Howie knew Reich wanted Wentz badly and used it to swindle a 1st round pick.

Colts were bidding against themselves once Chicago bowed out, and Howie still somehow manged to pull out a 1st + change. Respect.

This is how Howie does things. He "wins the trade” and that’s why I don’t see in any he’s giving up three firsts (or multiple firsts at all) for any other teams old quarterback or pain of a quarterback. That’s not winning the deal, but Howie does love to be talked about so he will keep things vague to let the rumors keep flying. 

15 hours ago, EagleJoe8 said:

Right?!?!

 

 

So anyway, Wentz or Foles??

 

 

Howie drafted both of them. 🤷‍♂️

[NOTW]

Howie needs to be put on the financial side like Banner was and get someone over personnel...fire Andy Weidl.

[UK_EaglesFan89]

2 minutes ago, NOTW said:

Howie needs to be put on the financial side like Banner was and get someone over personnel...fire Andy Weidl.

Agreed. I mean to be honest I wouldn't have Howie anywhere near the team but yeah if he's going to stay around then move him to the financial side. He's not good at building teams. 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, NOTW said:

Howie needs to be put on the financial side like Banner was and get someone over personnel...fire Andy Weidl.

Weidl is fine, he just needs final say on the picks instead of Howie.

 

 

[ToDie4Eagles]

[Mike030270]

Please fire Howie

[Uscg-green]

Your honor, the people present exhibit A. Reagor over Jefferson. The prosecution rests.

[NOTW]

Look at 2 recent drafts that were considered at the time to be "historic" for being deep at certain positions, and those positions happened to line up with positions the Eagles desperately needed.  How did Howie perform?

2017:  Corner and Running Back

Takes Barnett the DE in the 1st, he's a JAG who became a liability and now will be let go in free agency
Corners: Sydney Jones injured red shirt and Rasul Douglas - both busts that get cut
Running back: Donell Pumphrey

2020: Wide Receiver

Howie ignores draft boards and BPA and just tries to throw "speed" at the wall and see what sticks.  The best he could get out of 4 draft picks used on wide receivers is a decent backup in Watkins.

Reagor: 1st round bust
Hightower: practice squad
Watkins: decent backup
Traded for Marquise Goodwin, never played for the Eagles

 

[Guest]

Once you add Brooks and all the dummy void stuff for guys like Nelson, Eagles soar back into first place with $51,890,633 in dead cap for 2022.  Good job cap guy.

 

 

[EagleJoe8]

2 hours ago, NOTW said:

Look at 2 recent drafts that were considered at the time to be "historic" for being deep at certain positions, and those positions happened to line up with positions the Eagles desperately needed.  How did Howie perform?

2017:  Corner and Running Back

Takes Barnett the DE in the 1st, he's a JAG who became a liability and now will be let go in free agency
Corners: Sydney Jones injured red shirt and Rasul Douglas - both busts that get cut
Running back: Donell Pumphrey

2020: Wide Receiver

Howie ignores draft boards and BPA and just tries to throw "speed" at the wall and see what sticks.  The best he could get out of 4 draft picks used on wide receivers is a decent backup in Watkins.

Reagor: 1st round bust
Hightower: practice squad
Watkins: decent backup
Traded for Marquise Goodwin, never played for the Eagles

 

I know it’s minor in the grand scheme of things, but I’m not bothered much by the Goodwin deal. It was only a 7th rounder, and Goodwin had good reason to opt out, plus we got that pick back anyway.  
 

 

But all the other stuff, yes flame away lol. 

[NOTW]

20 minutes ago, EagleJoe8 said:

I know it’s minor in the grand scheme of things, but I’m not bothered much by the Goodwin deal. It was only a 7th rounder, and Goodwin had good reason to opt out, plus we got that pick back anyway.  
 

 

But all the other stuff, yes flame away lol. 

Oh of course, a 7th rounder isn't a big deal in the scheme of things. It's just in the approach to throw 4 different picks in the same draft at the WR position.  Yes it was a need, but there were other needs.  And they historically aren't good at drafting WRs unless higher picks (like Smith).

[EagleJoe8]

14 minutes ago, NOTW said:

Oh of course, a 7th rounder isn't a big deal in the scheme of things. It's just in the approach to throw 4 different picks in the same draft at the WR position.  Yes it was a need, but there were other needs.  And they historically aren't good at drafting WRs unless higher picks (like Smith).

Yup. As has been mentioned many times, Howie can do ok if he’s picking towards the top of a round, and/or if he’s picking O-Linemen. And I’m sure it’s no coincidence we have one of, if not the best O-Line coach out there. Aside from that, it’s JAGs or horrid players. Guys like Sweat or Maddox. Nice players, but not difference makers. 

[MillerTime]

4 hours ago, downundermike said:

Once you add Brooks and all the dummy void stuff for guys like Nelson, Eagles soar back into first place with $51,890,633 in dead cap for 2022.  Good job cap guy.

 

 

Post June 1st retirement. Probably will set it up as one of their Post 1st designations so they can use the cap space during free agency. It will be a 5 million cap hit in 2022 and a 10 million cap hit in 2023. Giving the Eagles an extra 13.5 million for 2022.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, MillerTime said:

Post June 1st retirement. Probably will set it up as one of their Post 1st designations so they can use the cap space during free agency. It will be a 5 million cap hit in 2022 and a 10 million cap hit in 2023. Giving the Eagles an extra 13.5 million for 2022.

They are going to have that designation elsewhere.  If Kelce retires, his contract was structured specifically for the post June 1 designation, so it may not be an option depending on what other moves they plan to make.

But on a positive news front, with the June 1 designation used on Brooks or Kelce, we are back in first place for 2023 dead cap.  #winning.

And just a heads up, if you use the June 1 designation, you can not spend that cap space until June 1.

[MillerTime]

Just now, downundermike said:

They are going to have that designation elsewhere.  If Kelce retires, his contract was structured specifically for the post June 1 designation, so it may not be an option depending on what other moves they plan to make.

But on a positive news front, with the June 1 designation used on Brooks or Kelce, we are back in first place for 2023 dead cap.  #winning.

And just a heads up, if you use the June 1 designation, you can not spend that cap space until June 1.

I know this. But there are ways around that if they really want the extra cap this year. They may just go with what they have. And let the cap savings he gives us post june 1st rollover to 2023. If so…

2022: 5,939,235 million in dead cap

2023: 9,797,000 million in dead cap

Cap savings:
2022: 13,500,000, won’t be available till june 1st, can be used on rookies and roll over

2023: 13,700,000.

2024: 15,500,000

 

 

 

 

[NOTW]

PC today.

Said yes Hurts will be 2022 starter.  Then later reporter said you said that last year about Wentz.  Howie laughed, then gave a vague answer about always looking for opportunities at every position to improve.  

Asked about trading picks for a QB:  says he's open to opportunities to improve any position, vague answer.

Asked about not using 1st round picks on a LB in 40 years, corner in 20 years:  Howie gave vague answer about building the team and "we have a philosophy" but didn't say anything specific.  Certainly don't want to tip hand on any draft strategies.  

Is this rebuild year, transition, or is this a "go for it" period to make short-term decisions:  in building mode unless you're a top team with #1 or #2 seed, keep building the roster.

Draft assets:  open to trading back to collect a 2023 pick.

Brandon Brooks retiring?:  only discussed ending the season healthy and that's the only conversations so far.

Brandon Graham's role next year:  miss him, attacking rehab, chip on his shoulder and see a role for him next year, huge part of the team.

 

[UK_EaglesFan89]

3 hours ago, NOTW said:

Said yes Hurts will be 2022 starter.  Then later reporter said you said that last year about Wentz.  Howie laughed, then gave a vague answer about always looking for opportunities at every position to improve.  

Asked about trading picks for a QB:  says he's open to opportunities to improve any position, vague answer.

Asked about not using 1st round picks on a LB in 40 years, corner in 20 years:  Howie gave vague answer about building the team and "we have a philosophy" but didn't say anything specific.  Certainly don't want to tip hand on any draft strategies.  

In other words... He's going to look to upgrade the QB position but he's not going to state that openly just in case. 

He'll do his due diligence on the QB class but you'd expect that. 

He won't be drafting a LB. 

So really we didn't learn anything from the presser.

[kiwieagle]

4 hours ago, NOTW said:

PC today.

Said yes Hurts will be 2022 starter.  Then later reporter said you said that last year about Wentz.  Howie laughed, then gave a vague answer about always looking for opportunities at every position to improve.  

Asked about trading picks for a QB:  says he's open to opportunities to improve any position, vague answer.

Asked about not using 1st round picks on a LB in 40 years, corner in 20 years:  Howie gave vague answer about building the team and "we have a philosophy" but didn't say anything specific.  Certainly don't want to tip hand on any draft strategies.  

Is this rebuild year, transition, or is this a "go for it" period to make short-term decisions:  in building mode unless you're a top team with #1 or #2 seed, keep building the roster.

Draft assets:  open to trading back to collect a 2023 pick.

Brandon Brooks retiring?:  only discussed ending the season healthy and that's the only conversations so far.

Brandon Graham's role next year:  miss him, attacking rehab, chip on his shoulder and see a role for him next year, huge part of the team.

 

If you take a lot of what Howie said at face value (and I don't) but it was a lot about putting more talent around Hurts to help him succeed. If anything, hints at a more offensive bend to the high picks - wouldn't be surprising but wouldn't rule out multiple picks being used on an OL and/or a WR and/or a RB in the first two rounds