12 minutes ago, BayAreaLennie said:

You obviously have Hurts in the ‘bad passer’ category, so I am curious what you mean by that exactly.

I was typing when you posted:

 

Just now, VaBeach_Eagle said:

Is Hurts capable of being a 'good to great' passer? I don't have enough information to go on because I haven't been able to focus on football. The little that I have seen, I can see flashes... flashes on both sides of the coin, good and bad.

20 minutes ago, BayAreaLennie said:

You obviously have Hurts in the ‘bad passer’ category, so I am curious what you mean by that exactly.

If you mean accuracy, I have not seen much evidence of that - the vast majority of his throws seem to be on the money.  If you mean arm strength, I have not seen much evidence of that either - he seems to be able to make all the NFL throws with ample zip on the ball.

Is your opinion different about those things, or what exactly is it that makes you put Hurts in the category of ‘bad passer’?

There was something several weeks ago that his completion percentage on passes more than 3 yards past the line of scrimmage is 45.7%.

2 hours ago, VaBeach_Eagle said:

If I'd said that, I'd have said that. I didn't say that, though. But I assume, though could be mistaken, that you're referring to Hurts? This isn't his first season as a starter. He started 4 games in 2020 and has now started 15 games in 2021. So even going by the new 17 game schedule, he has more than a full season of starting experience and almost 2 full years of practice and training camps (I don't remember if or how TC's were limited in 2020, so we can call it 1 year for good measure). 

But to your point of 'first season', I don't think it's too much to ask that a starting professional (NFL) QB be, at the very least, a 'good' passer if you have a scale of 'bad passer', 'good passer' and 'great passer'. Running ability is a plus, but if your QB can't at least be a good passer, then you don't have a QB. You have a RB that takes direct snaps on every play. 

It is his first season as a starter.  Last season he was the backup QB who simply started 4 games. This year he was the actual starting QB, lol. 

Anyway, I think the guy has done enough to prove that he should be our #1 option at QB, unless you can somehow trade for a better option without giving up the farm.  He also needs to still do well in camp next year in order to keep the job. 

10 minutes ago, MF POON said:

It is his first season as a starter.  Last season he was the backup QB who simply started 4 games. This year he was the actual starting QB, lol. 

Semantics. He started the entire final quarter of the 2020 season and all but one game of the 2021 season. He's been a starting QB in the NFL for 19 games. 

I'm not saying he's not 'the guy' or can't be 'the guy' or any of that. I just want a QB who is a good passer. One who (on passing plays) wants to pass first... pass second and if all else fails, try to pass third... then take off and run if it's open. 

Is he our best option for 2022? I don't have that answer. If he is, then he is and that's fine. If he isn't, then shouldn't we be going toward our best option?

2 hours ago, NOTW said:

he said "good to great" not "top tier" you're using a straw man.

Hurts is good so he obviously meant top tier.

3 minutes ago, Infam said:

Hurts is good so he obviously meant top tier.

Now you're assuming what someone "meant" by literally words "good to great."  His own reply:

3 hours ago, VaBeach_Eagle said:

If I'd said that, I'd have said that. I didn't say that, though.

...I don't think it's too much to ask that a starting professional (NFL) QB be, at the very least, a 'good' passer if you have a scale of 'bad passer', 'good passer' and 'great passer'. Running ability is a plus, but if your QB can't at least be a good passer, then you don't have a QB. You have a RB that takes direct snaps on every play. 

 

On 12/30/2021 at 7:26 PM, ManchesterEagle said:

I was having a discussion in the Hurts topic and one of the posters suggested most on the board were thinking the same way for 2022.

I'm not so sure and just interested to see where people are at.

I've included Wilson and Rodgers, even though I don't think either is a realistic possibility (Wilson has basically said he's staying in Seattle, doubtful Rodgers would come to the Eagles)

Note - in most of the scenarios, the Eagles may still draft a QB, but I've assumed if it's not in the first, the QB will unlikely be in the immediate plans for 2022.

I think Hurts barring injury is the quarterback of the future for the Eagles.

He likely is only going to get better in his third season, especially with Siriani growing into the job as HC (he is definitely a candidate for Coach of the Year given how he got this team from a 2-5 start to having already clinched a playoff berth at 9-7 with the game this week completely meaningless). 

59 minutes ago, Wallyhorse said:

I think Hurts barring injury is the quarterback of the future for the Eagles.

He likely is only going to get better in his third season, especially with Siriani growing into the job as HC (he is definitely a candidate for Coach of the Year given how he got this team from a 2-5 start to having already clinched a playoff berth at 9-7 with the game this week completely meaningless). 

I think @brkmsn has been posting a tweet that shows Hurts numbers when throwing to Goedert and Smith have him at a very high passer rating and high completion percentage so it’s clear that if Jalen had some better weapons he’d be even better as a quarterback. I really would like to see another reliable receiver brought onto the team. Another year of Smith getting better would help out immensely too. To me it seems the pieces are there. People say Hurts has no arm strength, but we have seen him fit passes in tight spots and over throw guys in the WFT game alone. He has all the tools, be he needs to put it together more consistently. 

"Schefter, the most plugged-in football insider out there, joined 97.5 The Fanatic's John Kincade show on Wednesday to talk all things Eagles, and one particular part of his conversation with Kincade and the crew really stood out to me:

"If the Eagles still want to go out and get a quarterback this offseason - and I still think they might, we'll see how it unfolds, if they want to go out and get Russell Wilson, Deshaun Watson, Aaron Rodgers, you name the guy - somebody will be very happy to take Jalen Hurts off their hands. "I think that they have themselves right now somebody who has value around the league."

https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/eagles/nfl-rumors-did-jalen-hurts-success-make-him-eagles-trade-chip

People talked about flipping Hurts in the past, but ohe has to wonder if Jalen has upped his value this much in one season if it’s better to keep him or dump him, but if the Eagles could pull a first for him then it does lessen the blow of giving up three first for someone like Rodgers, Watson, or Wilson. 

The best case scenario for someone like me, who wants the Birds to trade for one of the Big 3, is if Hurts can up his value enough for us to save an extra outgoing 1st.

So instead of sending 3 ones, we send 2 ones + Hurts, that way we still get to keep a #1 pick and have full draft capital going forward. Heck I'll throw in Dillard as a parting gift...

4 hours ago, VaBeach_Eagle said:

Semantics. He started the entire final quarter of the 2020 season and all but one game of the 2021 season. He's been a starting QB in the NFL for 19 games. 

I'm not saying he's not 'the guy' or can't be 'the guy' or any of that. I just want a QB who is a good passer. One who (on passing plays) wants to pass first... pass second and if all else fails, try to pass third... then take off and run if it's open. 

Is he our best option for 2022? I don't have that answer. If he is, then he is and that's fine. If he isn't, then shouldn't we be going toward our best option?

I want a QB who is a great runner who can pass well enough.  Hurts is a great runner who can pass well enough.

The Eagles, with this great runner, are going to the playoffs.  30 Million of the cap is going for Wentz bonus.  Still, playoffs. 

2 hours ago, D-Shiznit said:

The best case scenario for someone like me, who wants the Birds to trade for one of the Big 3, is if Hurts can up his value enough for us to save an extra outgoing 1st.

So instead of sending 3 ones, we send 2 ones + Hurts, that way we still get to keep a #1 pick and have full draft capital going forward. Heck I'll throw in Dillard as a parting gift...

I just don’t see why anyone could possibly want to trade 2+ first round picks for aging vets who have a total of two super rings between them. It’s not like you’re trading for Brady. At this point in their careers it would be asinine to trade 2 or 3 firsts (or two firsts plus Hurts), plus pay a premium salary for either of those guys.

As far as Watson, sure I’d do a couple firsts for him if it wasn’t for the legal issue, but there’s no way I’m touching him now. 

I don't want Wilson, or Rodgers. If they're going to pass on Hurts and give up a lot, then let it be for Watson. He's 26 and worth the cost. I don't want to bring in some 33, or 38 year old that may retire within a handful of seasons.

1 hour ago, Random Reglar said:

I want a QB who is a great runner ...

Been there, done that since 1985. "Great runner" is exciting and fun, but hasn't ever gotten us a Lombardi. I want our QB, be it Hurts or Cashew or whoever, to be a passer first and foremost. 

Of course, now that I've said that it hasn't ever gotten us a Lombardi, we'll be hoisting one in February... and I'll be happy as a lark if that happens. 

I think some may think that my comment is somehow a dig or insult toward Hurts, but it isn't. If Hurts can play the position well enough to consistently win and eventually bring us a Lombardi, I'm all for it. 

3 hours ago, VaBeach_Eagle said:

Been there, done that since 1985. "Great runner" is exciting and fun, but hasn't ever gotten us a Lombardi. I want our QB, be it Hurts or Cashew or whoever, to be a passer first and foremost. 

Of course, now that I've said that it hasn't ever gotten us a Lombardi, we'll be hoisting one in February... and I'll be happy as a lark if that happens. 

I think some may think that my comment is somehow a dig or insult toward Hurts, but it isn't. If Hurts can play the position well enough to consistently win and eventually bring us a Lombardi, I'm all for it. 

different people have different opinions about what is best.

I just don't like the whole "let's measure the QB only by the throwing" thing, which is not uncommon.   This argument pops up everywhere there's a running QB.    Wasn't saying that you were rooting for Hurts to fail. 

To me this argument comes down to  if the Eagles trade for one of the available guys they’re basically giving up about a seven player swing. Is any of these three (Rodgers, Wilson, and Watson) worth about seven players? Trading for any of these three likely will cost at least three picks, and they will dominate any cap space left. Right now the Eagles have between 12-13 mil of capspace, but they could probably get that number to about 30 mil. Considering the Eagles just resigned three of their own and that cost them about 12 mil against the 2022 Cap at most by trading for one of these three plus their 2022 salaries the most the Eagles could likely get are some minimum contract prove it deal veterans. If the Eagles held pat, used their 3 firsts on the team, and with Jalen’s very low salary the Eagles with 30 mil could still sign some significant free agents. They could pull at least two maybe three upper level free agent talents. To me the answer is none of these three are worth giving up a chance to build a talented team for a longer period of time just for one or two seasons of hope. Wilson is a diminishing player, Rodgers is hinting retirement, and Watson faces a suspension, and he’s already proven he can’t do it alone. That’s not to mention his year of rust and injury history. To me it’s obvious that this team must be built through the draft and impact free agents. Not by having an incomplete roster and hoping one of these guys can throw the team to a victory. 

Honestly it would be dumb to add a new QB in the offseason. The draft sucks for QBs this year, and no way I’d want to trade what it would take to get one of the vets mentioned. 
 

Roll with Hurts again next year, and see how much he improves in his second season as the starter. If they aren’t convinced he’s the guy after that, then hopefully they can draft one in 2023. 

Jalen Hurts has comparable stats to Lamar Jackson this season with regards to completion %, passing yards, passing TDs, rushing yards, and you don't see the Ravens talking about whether Jackson is their starter or not.

Sure, Jackson has had a bit of a decline since his 2019 MVP season, but Hurts is only in his 2nd year in the league, whereas Jackson is in his 4th. It is too early to close the book on Hurts being the QB of the future. The potential is there for Hurts to do even better next year, provided an improvement in surrounding cast.

Let's not forget what improving the supporting cast around Carson Wentz in 2017 did for him statistically. He went from Jordan Matthews, Dorial Green-Beckham, Ryan Mathews, Wendell Smallwood, etc. in 2016 to Alshon Jeffrey, Torrey Smith, LeGarrette Blount, Jay Ajayi, etc. in 2017.

I would love for the team to get Hurts a reliable big bodied WR2, whether that be a veteran option like Mike Williams or even DJ Chark, a draft pick like Treylon Burks or Drake London, or someone via trade. The current running back room should be sufficient if they retain Jordan Howard, otherwise we'll need a power back.

15 minutes ago, nipples said:

Honestly it would be dumb to add a new QB in the offseason. The draft sucks for QBs this year, and no way I’d want to trade what it would take to get one of the vets mentioned. 
 

Roll with Hurts again next year, and see how much he improves in his second season as the starter. If they aren’t convinced he’s the guy after that, then hopefully they can draft one in 2023. 

I get your point and I'm kind of there with you. But I don't think it would be dumb to add a QB in the off season. If they like a guy and he falls to them in the draft then that's not dumb. It would be dumb I think to trade assets to get a QB.

54 minutes ago, nipples said:

Honestly it would be dumb to add a new QB in the offseason. The draft sucks for QBs this year, and no way I’d want to trade what it would take to get one of the vets mentioned. 
 

Roll with Hurts again next year, and see how much he improves in his second season as the starter. If they aren’t convinced he’s the guy after that, then hopefully they can draft one in 2023. 

This^^^.

It's a no-brainer.  The only QB in the NFL who has improved more this year than Hurts is Joe Burrow and the next Joe Burrow isn't in the 2022 draft class so that's a non-starter.  With a treasure trove of draft picks, the Eagles have a great opportunity to upgrade the roster in multiple areas of need, so why would they waste those picks to get an expensive guy who is: aging and regressing (Wilson, $35 million a year), out of the game for a year with pending litigation (Watson, $39 million) or aging and has a screw loose (Rodgers, $33 million)?  They wouldn't. 

Hurts ($1.5 million) is 23 years old. It takes quarterbacks time to develop. Peyton Manning was 3-13 his first year.  Troy Aikman was 0-11 as a starter his first year.  Aaron Rodgers threw 1 touchdown - ONE - in his first three years combined.  

Roll with Hurts and Minshew.  Easy. 

1 hour ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

I get your point and I'm kind of there with you. But I don't think it would be dumb to add a QB in the off season. If they like a guy and he falls to them in the draft then that's not dumb. It would be dumb I think to trade assets to get a QB.

If they like a guy in this trash QB draft then yeah it’s dumb. 

1 hour ago, nipples said:

Honestly it would be dumb to add a new QB in the offseason. The draft sucks for QBs this year, and no way I’d want to trade what it would take to get one of the vets mentioned. 
 

Roll with Hurts again next year, and see how much he improves in his second season as the starter. If they aren’t convinced he’s the guy after that, then hopefully they can draft one in 2023. 

As long as they spend 2/3 of those picks on D I don't really care what they do with the other one.  More D, WR/OL, trade back/up/'23 draft.  Or even a Qb.  Malik Willis is an amazing top end talent who probably needs at least one red shirt year.  If that dude falls into the mid-late 20's the eagles are in a really, really good position to develop him. Redhsirt him behind Hurts/Minshew in '22, and then let him compete ahead of Hurts contract year in '23.

2 hours ago, nipples said:

If they like a guy in this trash QB draft then yeah it’s dumb. 

I don't think it is trash. Look I'm not sold on any of these prospects. I'm not as high on these guys as some of the guys in previous years but that doesn't mean a lot. People didn't have Mahomes as a potential future year. Mac Jones was like the 5th QB off the board. Lawrence has not looked great as this supposed great prospect.

If, and I stress if you can get Rodgers/Watson/Wilson how in the world would that be dumb?

I honestly don't know what's gotten into people. You have a chance to add either one of the 3 best QBs in NFL history and current league MVP in Rodgers, one of the best QBs of this generation in Wilson, or a top 6 QB under 27 in Watson and that is "dumb."

If the Eagles had any of those guys currently on the roster, aside from maybe Watson because of his legal issues, and someone started a thread saying "Would you trade Rodgers away for draft picks and Jalen Hurts?" people would think the thread was trolling and it would probably be deleted by mods for trolling. That's how laughable it would be.

If you can add any of those guys, of course you do it. The Eagles would be an instant contender, sans Watson if he gets suspended by Goodell.

I don't know when Eagles fans got so complacent with mediocrity. They have a mediocre QB and a mediocre season and people are cool not pursuing upgrades at the most important position in sports. INSANITY!

4 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

If, and I stress if you can get Rodgers/Watson/Wilson how in the world would that be dumb?

I honestly don't know what's gotten into people. You have a chance to add either one of the 3 best QBs in NFL history and current league MVP in Rodgers, one of the best QBs of this generation in Wilson, or a top 6 QB under 27 in Watson and that is "dumb."

If the Eagles had any of those guys currently on the roster, aside from maybe Watson because of his legal issues, and someone started a thread saying "Would you trade Rodgers away for draft picks and Jalen Hurts?" people would think the thread was trolling. That's how laughable it would be.

If you can add any of those guys, of course you do it. The Eagles would be an instant contender, sans Watson if he gets suspended by Goodell.

I don't know when Eagles fans got so complacent with mediocrity. They have a mediocre QB and a mediocre season and people are cool not pursuing upgrades at the most important position in sports. INSANITY!