41 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Part of their outfield issue is they traded away O’hoppe who was a top 100 prospect and an offensively gifted catcher for marsh. Whom the angels gave up after a season and a half after being their top prospect. That trade hurts because if they used ohoppe’s value properly they have another competent outfielder. Instead they basically pissed away his value and hurt their long term future. It’s why i said at the time dont trade him for a guy the angels gave up on and you have to fix to Maximize value.

Then you get into bad contracts with Turner, Nola and Walker. Add on the way hoffman’s contract is structured he’s actually making less than Romano in year 1. They clear money in year 2 and 3 and could’ve afforded Hoffman. They just made a gamble Romano would be better an it blew up in their face. Walker being useless basically is around $20 mil they could’ve used to get a closer like tanner scott and a better outfielder rather than spending just $20 mil for Kepler and Romano

Another issue is they’ve done a bad job moving guys through the minors to be ready to take steps as BP arms. They have SP in the minors like painter, Johnson, and some other guys. But they don’t have bullpen arms close. Cause they just make everyone starters like mcgary has back end bullpen stuff. It’s likely the spot where he succeeds in any mlb role and would be better than Hernandez, Ross or Ruiz. Yet he’s working as a starter. Abel also has backend bullpen stuff but have him as a starter.

I’d add Dombrowski has made some bad trades/moves in general that has nothing to do with contracts that have hurt us. like trading away Dominguez for Austin Hayes and Dominguez is cheap and would look great right now as a RHP backend bullpen guy. Also dealt away verling for Soto. Verling right now solves a corner outfield spot instead of spending 10 mil on Kepler. if Dombrowski didn’t make some bad trades you have a Dominguez, verling and potentially a competent mlb CF from the O’hoppe trade.

There is probably both science and art to transitioning failed starter prospects into bullpen arms. Like you said, Mcgary and Abel are the first to come to mind.

Any 20 year old that throws 98+ with a breaking pitch with bite...obviously you want to try to develop them into a front end starter. Exactly when the time comes to rock them up as 1-2 inning bullpen arms is tricky. I know they talk about stiff wrists and 2 pitch arsenals...but the last one, obviously, is age.

Mcgarry is going to be 26 this year. We are done here. Put him in the pen and see what you can get out of him as a 1-and-done pitcher now. He could be bullpen help in the majors by the summer. He should have preparing for that immediately in spring training.

23 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

There is probably both science and art to transitioning failed starter prospects into bullpen arms. Like you said, Mcgary and Abel are the first to come to mind.

Any 20 year old that throws 98+ with a breaking pitch with bite...obviously you want to try to develop them into a front end starter. Exactly when the time comes to rock them up as 1-2 inning bullpen arms is tricky. I know they talk about stiff wrists and 2 pitch arsenals...but the last one, obviously, is age.

Mcgarry is going to be 26 this year. We are done here. Put him in the pen and see what you can get out of him as a 1-and-done pitcher now. He could be bullpen help in the majors by the summer. He should have preparing for that immediately in spring training.

I’d add in the draft there’s some college players that are 22-24now. They have solid sometimes even good stuff just older so ceiling isn’t as high you can take in the middle rounds and they would be ready for bullpen roles within 1-2 years. We’ve been bad at selecting those guys. We tend to stay with younger guys with higher ceilings

McGarry and Abel should be thrown into bullpen roles at their age and having control issues. Much easier to try to have their control be there for an inning than 5-6.

Bullpen is going to get tattooed having to go 7 innings and this lineup still can’t hit worth crap

At least Ranger is gonna be back soon

What happened to Sanchez?

25 minutes ago, vsptroops said:

What happened to Sanchez?

Apparently hurt his forearm

5 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

Apparently hurt his forearm

Great, he'll be out at least a month.

7 minutes ago, vsptroops said:

Great, he'll be out at least a month.

Be lucky if it’s a month. It could require surgery and the idiotic Phillies will try rehab for 2.5 months then he’ll need surgery anyway and miss 2025 and 2026.

This team is cooked

I’ll say it, Kerkering is a mental Midget. Feels like he always comes up small in big situation.

6 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I’ll say it, Kerkering is a mental Midget. Feels like he always comes up small in big situation.

They just need five relievers. No big deal.

Just now, Diehardfan said:

They just need five relievers. No big deal.

Hey strahm is ok lol

Ah yes a Phillies base running gaff staple

9 minutes ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

He doesn't have any food options

This feels like a "Should sell at the deadline, but won't" type of season. Because the Mets roster isn't that good and they will come crashing down to earth sooner or later, no one's running away with this division. But this team is old, declining, and expensive, and they badly need a table reset. One stepback year to help their future wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. But the ownership and front office level seems to be totally delusional about the capabilities of this roster so I'm expecting them to still think they're contender even if they're .500 come July.

10 minutes ago, Sack that QB said:

This feels like a "Should sell at the deadline, but won't" type of season. Because the Mets roster isn't that good and they will come crashing down to earth sooner or later, no one's running away with this division. But this team is old, declining, and expensive, and they badly need a table reset. One stepback year to help their future wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. But the ownership and front office level seems to be totally delusional about the capabilities of this roster so I'm expecting them to still think they're contender even if they're .500 come July.

I said this the other day. If you get to the trade deadline and you’re still hovering around 500 or even below 500 then you’ve basically been this for about 162 game stretch. It’s not changing. At that point should start trading some of the assets. Even with schwarber being a FA at the end of 2025, a playoff contender would make the move for him and give a nice prospect. Castellanos with a year left is a tradable. Strahm, Alvarado, Bohm, Ranger (if he hits like he had the last week) and even Kepler (as a bench bat for a playoff team) are going to have value. I’d even consider wheeler at that point cause you likely aren’t competing the following year anyway so cash out. But I’d ask him what he wants before doing it and try nola first. Would suck to deal wheeler but you’d hit a jackpot type offer for him if he is still elite. Plus have painter, luzardo and Sanchez as the future 1-2-3

But if the Phillies are .500 or worse by the deadline, trade guys like schwarber, Castellanos, wheeler, Nola, strahm, Alvarado and Bohm and stock up your prospect pool. That way rebuild isn’t as bad.

7 hours ago, e-a-g-l-e-s eagles! said:

I said this the other day. If you get to the trade deadline and you’re still hovering around 500 or even below 500 then you’ve basically been this for about 162 game stretch. It’s not changing. At that point should start trading some of the assets. Even with schwarber being a FA at the end of 2025, a playoff contender would make the move for him and give a nice prospect. Castellanos with a year left is a tradable. Strahm, Alvarado, Bohm, Ranger (if he hits like he had the last week) and even Kepler (as a bench bat for a playoff team) are going to have value. I’d even consider wheeler at that point cause you likely aren’t competing the following year anyway so cash out. But I’d ask him what he wants before doing it and try nola first. Would suck to deal wheeler but you’d hit a jackpot type offer for him if he is still elite. Plus have painter, luzardo and Sanchez as the future 1-2-3

But if the Phillies are .500 or worse by the deadline, trade guys like schwarber, Castellanos, wheeler, Nola, strahm, Alvarado and Bohm and stock up your prospect pool. That way rebuild isn’t as bad.

may be the right road to take, but I understand the hesitation to take it. If they pull that lever, it’s a looooong road back. They’ll have a good rotation quickly, but they have zero…..zero bats. They don’t have immediately or reliably projectable bats in the system (sorry Miller). And Stott is the only young bat on the team (and I can really only use him because he’s on a hot streak….hes still nothing special at the plate).

It could take 10 years to get a lineup. They are terrible with drafting and developing bats. So I understand the sentiment to ride the one we’ve got into the ground.

did jerry jones put a hex on this ownership/fo?

4 hours ago, eagle45 said:

may be the right road to take, but I understand the hesitation to take it. If they pull that lever, it’s a looooong road back. They’ll have a good rotation quickly, but they have zero…..zero bats. They don’t have immediately or reliably projectable bats in the system (sorry Miller). And Stott is the only young bat on the team (and I can really only use him because he’s on a hot streak….hes still nothing special at the plate).

It could take 10 years to get a lineup. They are terrible with drafting and developing bats. So I understand the sentiment to ride the one we’ve got into the ground.

Tbh if you make those moves you aren’t trying to win the very next year or even the year after. You probably aren’t until 3-4 years down the road. They have miller. They also have Tait who’s 18 and looks like he’s 2-3 years away. I think if you deal wheeler you are going to get at least one great prospect and probably a second good prospect. He’s 34 but if he pitches like he has then a contender will pay for him especially if they get 2 years more and he is still good. Schwarber i also think would get you a good prospect. Even with his contract up at the end of the year, he might be the best bat on the market and he’s considered a team guy. Those two would bring some good prospects into the system.

Imo the issue is more will Dombrowski admit at that point his roster construction has failed. And will Middleton be accepting of being in a 2-3 year rebuild before they spend serious money on free agents. Then you also have the Bryce situation. Whether or not he’s ok with it or would he waive his NTC as well. If he waives his NTC then you could potentially get a nice haul from wheeler, schwarber and Bryce. That said don’t see Bryce waiving it regardless.