March 7, 20224 yr 7 hours ago, Green_Guinness said: Just watched it, though admittedly didn't get the full effect since it was a cam version online. Reveal hidden contents Liked the story and there was some good action, but there was no introduction into how Bruce became Batman as it just jumped right into there being a vigilante in Gotham. Maybe I was expecting too much for a 2.75hr film. Also thought there wasn't near enough of him being Bruce vs him being Batman. This was different take which is fine, but I was expecting more balance between the roles. Even the Nolan films, especially the first 2, had Bale being Bruce almost as much him being Batman, and that's the delicate balance that makes the character complex. Maybe I'm being picky here. I liked Andy Serkis as Alfred, but that role was marginalized as more of background scenery. I know some of you hated Bale's Batman because of the voice, but the stories were solid and well rounded. Maybe this is just the opening act and more will be shared in the 2nd installment, but for the length of the film IMO they could have offered more than they did. Overall I thought it was good, not great, but good. It was a more simplified Batman without the bells and whistles Nolan's had, a more direct version. Though, I would expect a billionaire to have all the tech and tools like Bale's Batman had to create an advantage over the 'bad' guys. Again, get it's a different take and it wasn't wrong or bad, I just thought Nolan did a better job of it. But that's 3 films vs just 1 so I'm willing to give it another go to see if they expand on this one and bring it more of the backstory (yes, which we all know, but still good to see it painted in a different light) and what villains he has to face going forward. Spoiler I think this is what people are missing, this is a young Batman not a middle aged Batman that has already gotten over the death of his parents and using his wealth and powers as Bruce to help the city as well as batman. This version is a young Batman who is still angry over the loss of his parents and does not think the legacy of the Wayne family would have any impact on fixing Gotham. Also Bruce is also confused at one point in the movie where he thought his parents may have been corrupt making him want to further himself from the Wayne family legacy. Towards the end Alfred was explaining to him that he needs Bruce to help fix the city it can't just be Batman.
March 7, 20224 yr Went yesterday with the wife and a group of friends. Long story short this is a movie for Bat-nerds like myself, not the casual fan. I thoroughly enjoyed it and have it as my #2 Bat-film behind The Dark Knight. Loved that we finally got to see his "world’s greatest detective” side. Pattinson needs to bulk up a bit more before the next one, but for me he was the best in costume Batman. His brutality was on full display and I loved it.
March 7, 20224 yr 45 minutes ago, Outlaw said: Went yesterday with the wife and a group of friends. Long story short this is a movie for Bat-nerds like myself, not the casual fan. I thoroughly enjoyed it and have it as my #2 Bat-film behind The Dark Knight. Loved that we finally got to see his "world’s greatest detective” side. Pattinson needs to bulk up a bit more before the next one, but for me he was the best in costume Batman. His brutality was on full display and I loved it. I'm glad you liked it and appreciated it for being a different take on a Batman movie. People ruin movies for themselves by always comparing it to the last one or it's not like the original or whatever. Put all the Nolan stuff out of your mind for this one and you realize it's a pretty damn good Batman and I'm excited to see how it evolves.
March 7, 20224 yr Author 10 hours ago, Green_Guinness said: Just watched it, though admittedly didn't get the full effect since it was a cam version online. Reveal hidden contents Liked the story and there was some good action, but there was no introduction into how Bruce became Batman as it just jumped right into there being a vigilante in Gotham. Maybe I was expecting too much for a 2.75hr film. Also thought there wasn't near enough of him being Bruce vs him being Batman. This was different take which is fine, but I was expecting more balance between the roles. Even the Nolan films, especially the first 2, had Bale being Bruce almost as much him being Batman, and that's the delicate balance that makes the character complex. Maybe I'm being picky here. I liked Andy Serkis as Alfred, but that role was marginalized as more of background scenery. I know some of you hated Bale's Batman because of the voice, but the stories were solid and well rounded. Maybe this is just the opening act and more will be shared in the 2nd installment, but for the length of the film IMO they could have offered more than they did. Overall I thought it was good, not great, but good. It was a more simplified Batman without the bells and whistles Nolan's had, a more direct version. Though, I would expect a billionaire to have all the tech and tools like Bale's Batman had to create an advantage over the 'bad' guys. Again, get it's a different take and it wasn't wrong or bad, I just thought Nolan did a better job of it. But that's 3 films vs just 1 so I'm willing to give it another go to see if they expand on this one and bring it more of the backstory (yes, which we all know, but still good to see it painted in a different light) and what villains he has to face going forward. Spoiler the lack of bruce scenes is more because, right now, hes not bruce wayne, hes batman. thats why selina kept saying about how the cat is who she really was, and "selina the waitress" was her mask. its supposed to show that Bruce is the mask and Batman is his real self at this point in time. also, i thought they did a great job of explaining his origin without showing it on screen for the 10,000th time.
March 7, 20224 yr 46 minutes ago, BFit said: Hide contents the lack of bruce scenes is more because, right now, hes not bruce wayne, hes batman. thats why selina kept saying about how the cat is who she really was, and "selina the waitress" was her mask. its supposed to show that Bruce is the mask and Batman is his real self at this point in time. also, i thought they did a great job of explaining his origin without showing it on screen for the 10,000th time. Agreed 100% like outlaw said this isn't for casual Batman fans.
March 7, 20224 yr @Bwestbrook36 and @BFit Spoiler Good points. This version is taking a different angle than previous ones that we are used to. I don't mind doing things different, but I was surprised how they just jumped right into it. Since it was a cam version it lacked the quality of audio/video and I know I wasn't able to pick up on everything as it does make it not as easy to watch and get into. Some of these cam versions are decent to pretty good, this one wasn't. I wanted to check it out and see what the hype was about. I'll wait until a DVD version comes out to watch it again.
March 7, 20224 yr 44 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said: Agreed 100% like outlaw said this isn't for casual Batman fans. I disagree with this. Studios don’t spent $200M+ to make a movie not intended for the causals. I would say it’s a film for casual Batman fans that pays way more homage to the character the hardcores are familiar with
March 7, 20224 yr 13 hours ago, Green_Guinness said: Just watched it, though admittedly didn't get the full effect since it was a cam version online. Reveal hidden contents Liked the story and there was some good action, but there was no introduction into how Bruce became Batman as it just jumped right into there being a vigilante in Gotham. Maybe I was expecting too much for a 2.75hr film. Also thought there wasn't near enough of him being Bruce vs him being Batman. This was different take which is fine, but I was expecting more balance between the roles. Even the Nolan films, especially the first 2, had Bale being Bruce almost as much him being Batman, and that's the delicate balance that makes the character complex. Maybe I'm being picky here. I liked Andy Serkis as Alfred, but that role was marginalized as more of background scenery. I know some of you hated Bale's Batman because of the voice, but the stories were solid and well rounded. Maybe this is just the opening act and more will be shared in the 2nd installment, but for the length of the film IMO they could have offered more than they did. Overall I thought it was good, not great, but good. It was a more simplified Batman without the bells and whistles Nolan's had, a more direct version. Though, I would expect a billionaire to have all the tech and tools like Bale's Batman had to create an advantage over the 'bad' guys. Again, get it's a different take and it wasn't wrong or bad, I just thought Nolan did a better job of it. But that's 3 films vs just 1 so I'm willing to give it another go to see if they expand on this one and bring it more of the backstory (yes, which we all know, but still good to see it painted in a different light) and what villains he has to face going forward. A couple other replies covered this but also: Spoiler We don't need to see - yet again - Bruce's parent shot and how he becomes Batman. Batman Begins did that perfectly to show and explain how and why he chose to dress up like a bat. To face his fears and make his enemies fear him instead and flip that around. We also don't need to see Bruce being a rich playboy in a dark serial killer movie. It showed that Bruce didn't want to be Bruce, he didn't care about the Wayne legacy he was focused on being "Vengeance" and finding the Riddler. High profile people were being murdered and the clock was ticking. There wasn't much point to showing him as Bruce the way Nolan's movies did, as a guy trying to keep up appearances. He did some of that like at the funeral. This was also partly based on Year One which Batman Begins also used a bit of. Bruce was away for years and even when he was back he was a recluse. When he shows up at the funeral people are surprised to see him. Batman Begins did a good job of showing that Bruce needed alibis and Bale sold being clueless about what was really going on, acting like an entitled rich guy so no one would suspect him. Selina and Riddler both told him that Batman is his true self. He was focused on being vengeance. By the end, he realizes that just going out and beating criminals to a pulp didn't change much. He realized he needed to be more of a symbol of hope to people. They showed this well when he rescued people from the flood, lit the flare and people were following him to safety. In the end he realized he needs to be more than just vengeance, but to give people hope. As bwest said, this is a young Batman still tortured and still seeing evil and being angry about it. As he matures he will grow and develop his tactics. Also, the rich guy with gadgets thing you mentioned. There was a trailer that included behind the scenes clips that said Bruce makes all this stuff himself. Bale's Batman had Fox to make things for him with things Wayne Enterprises already had he just modified it. In this one, they show tools and workspace and that he's hands on making things. He said in his narration that he's only been doing it for 2 years. Having said that, he had contact lenses that recorded video and fed it to a server...that's really advanced! He had some gadgets, a beefed up muscle car version of the Batmobile and even carried adrenaline to inject himself with. What more did you want?
March 7, 20224 yr Some more thoughts. Non-spoiler thoughts first: Pattinson was good in this. If you're concerned he looks like a brooding emo kid in the trailers, don't worry. Keaton's Bruce Wayne brooded and was a bit of a recluse too. Kilmer's was in therapy. Bale's Bruce Wayne was putting on a show as the millionaire playboy to hide his torment. The real star of the movie for me is Matt Reeves. The look and feel with the cinematography, score, shot selection, sound effects and showing the detective side of Batman was great. The 90s retro thing is popular now, and this takes you back to movie styles like Se7en, The Crow and others. I read a review that said the movie wants to make you feel unsettled just like the characters and he does that well with some of the shots and score. I think what hurts it somewhat is the timing. Audiences got used to the world building they were doing with the Justice League and Affleck as Batman. Then they threw in a Joker movie set in the 70s that was standalone, and now going backwards with a Batman in year 2 vs the older veteran Batman. This comes out 5 years after the last Batman appearance from Affleck. Batman Begins came out 8 years after Batman & Robin and even then some people were like oh, another Batman? Plus the Gotham TV show, the Lego Batman. I think for some fans this comes out of nowhere like why are they doing this now. But get past that and enjoy it for what it is. Uses the noir detective techniques really well. Even the voice overs that call back to old detective stories aren't cheesy, they are welcomed. I also love they made Batman something to be feared. The Riddler is a scary serial killer, but people also fear Batman. He comes across scary as well, almost like the Terminator he keeps coming for the bad guys. The cast were all good choices. Andy Serkis did NOT ham it up thankfully. However, he has such little screen time there was no need to cast someone popular they could have used an unknown. Colin Farrell is completely unrecognizable as the Penguin...but I don't really know the point of casting him then remaking him completely like that. Why not just hire an actor who looks more the part? He ended up not having all that much screen time. It ends up being a little bit distracting like "wow that's really Colin Ferrell?" instead of just being about the character. But at least he wasn't a literal penguin which was ridiculous in Batman Returns.
March 7, 20224 yr 51 minutes ago, Agent23 said: I disagree with this. Studios don’t spent $200M+ to make a movie not intended for the causals. I would say it’s a film for casual Batman fans that pays way more homage to the character the hardcores are familiar with I like this explanation makes more sense
March 7, 20224 yr 42 minutes ago, NOTW said: A couple other replies covered this but also: Reveal hidden contents We don't need to see - yet again - Bruce's parent shot and how he becomes Batman. Batman Begins did that perfectly to show and explain how and why he chose to dress up like a bat. To face his fears and make his enemies fear him instead and flip that around. We also don't need to see Bruce being a rich playboy in a dark serial killer movie. It showed that Bruce didn't want to be Bruce, he didn't care about the Wayne legacy he was focused on being "Vengeance" and finding the Riddler. High profile people were being murdered and the clock was ticking. There wasn't much point to showing him as Bruce the way Nolan's movies did, as a guy trying to keep up appearances. He did some of that like at the funeral. This was also partly based on Year One which Batman Begins also used a bit of. Bruce was away for years and even when he was back he was a recluse. When he shows up at the funeral people are surprised to see him. Batman Begins did a good job of showing that Bruce needed alibis and Bale sold being clueless about what was really going on, acting like an entitled rich guy so no one would suspect him. Selina and Riddler both told him that Batman is his true self. He was focused on being vengeance. By the end, he realizes that just going out and beating criminals to a pulp didn't change much. He realized he needed to be more of a symbol of hope to people. They showed this well when he rescued people from the flood, lit the flare and people were following him to safety. In the end he realized he needs to be more than just vengeance, but to give people hope. As bwest said, this is a young Batman still tortured and still seeing evil and being angry about it. As he matures he will grow and develop his tactics. Also, the rich guy with gadgets thing you mentioned. There was a trailer that included behind the scenes clips that said Bruce makes all this stuff himself. Bale's Batman had Fox to make things for him with things Wayne Enterprises already had he just modified it. In this one, they show tools and workspace and that he's hands on making things. That also will evolve as he gets older. He said in his narration that he's only been doing it for 2 years. Spoiler Do you think they did the riddler stuff to close to how Nolan did the joker scenes? Like using the media to draw Batman out of the shadows and to turn people of Gotham against him? I liked it but, it felt all the same in some ways.
March 7, 20224 yr Author 38 minutes ago, NOTW said: Some more thoughts. Non-spoiler thoughts first: Pattinson was good in this. If you're concerned he looks like a brooding emo kid in the trailers, don't worry. Keaton's Bruce Wayne brooded and was a bit of a recluse too. Kilmer's was in therapy. Bale's Bruce Wayne was putting on a show as the millionaire playboy to hide his torment. The real star of the movie for me is Matt Reeves. The look and feel with the cinematography, score, shot selection, sound effects and showing the detective side of Batman was great. The 90s retro thing is popular now, and this takes you back to movie styles like Se7en, The Crow and others. I read a review that said the movie wants to make you feel unsettled just like the characters and he does that well with some of the shots and score. I think what hurts it somewhat is the timing. Audiences got used to the world building they were doing with the Justice League and Affleck as Batman. Then they threw in a Joker movie set in the 70s that was standalone, and now going backwards with a Batman in year 2 vs the older veteran Batman. This comes out 5 years after the last Batman appearance from Affleck. Batman Begins was 8 years later and even then some people were like oh, another Batman? Plus the Gotham TV show, the Lego Batman. I think for some fans this comes out of nowhere like why are they doing this now. But get past that and enjoy it for what it is. Uses the noir detective techniques really well. Even the voice overs that call back to old detective stories aren't cheesy, they are welcomed. I also love they made Batman something to be feared. The Riddler is a scary serial killer, but people also fear Batman. He comes across scary as well, almost like the Terminator he keeps coming for the bad guys. The cast were all good choices. Andy Serkis did NOT ham it up thankfully. However, he has such little screen time there was no need to cast someone popular they could have used an unknown. Colin Farrell is completely unrecognizable as the Penguin...but I don't really know the point of casting him then remaking him completely like that. Why not just hire an actor who looks more the part? He ended up not having all that much screen time. It ends up being a little bit distracting like "wow that's really Colin Ferrell?" instead of just being about the character. But at least he wasn't a literal penguin which was ridiculous in Batman Returns. Spoiler talking about batman being feared, it would be cool is they introduced the Joker as the opposite. So how criminals think batman is hiding in every shadow, i want good people to be thinking that the joker is hiding in every shadow. have him being a menacing figure to the common person. also, in the early scenes with that skull faced gang, it would be cool if they took the kid that they showed being "scared straight" and made him a robin/duke thomas "the signal" character later in the series. like being faced with batman at that moment started a swing that would eventually lead to him heling batman. 9 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said: Hide contents Do you think they did the riddler stuff to close to how Nolan did the joker scenes? Like using the media to draw Batman out of the shadows and to turn people of Gotham against him? I liked it but, it felt all the same in some ways. Spoiler i feel like the comics now a days have a lot of media driven attacks on batman. plus with how prevelant the media is these days, i dont think it even dawned on me that it was similar to nolans joker
March 7, 20224 yr I enjoyed this, but some criticisms: Spoiler The riddles were mostly easy to figure out. The one toward the end with el rata, Batman figures it out but Gordon is completely clueless. A few seconds after Batman says it, Gordon repeats it like it's the hardest riddle ever and it makes him look dumb. I don't know if they were trying to suggest Batman is so smart and Gordon was impressed or what, but it made Gordon look dumb. They also didn't really explain why or how Bruce is the world's greatest detective. Alfred was back home cracking code and Batman was just good at guessing the riddles on the spot. Batman Begins showed how he learned to fight and study criminal behavior while he was away, we don't know here how exactly Bruce got detective skills. Also if he and Alfred are so smart and have been following all these clues, why would Alfred open the package that he should know is from the Riddler? You know he's targeting high profile people, he's already mentioned the Renewal project as a clue which Thomas Wayne started...so at least be safe about opening the package or wait for Bruce. I didn't like the ex machina type thing where Batman goes back to Riddler's apartment and the one cop guarding the door just happens to know what the carpet tool is because of his dad's job. For "the World's Greatest Detective" why didn't he research what the tool was himself? A quick google search would haven't answered that, or didn't anyone at the police lab study it to find out what it was? Not to mention the tow truck bed that lowers to make a ramp conveniently when he needs to jump over a tanker truck that is on fire. When comparing to the Joker in the Dark Knight there were too many similarities. The Joker targeted high profile figures in Gotham, left clues for Batman to solve, drew like-minded crazies to his cause, went "Saw" on someone by sewing a cell phone into their stomach, got caught on purpose as part of his larger plan, posted videos for the media to share, called for the unmasking of Batman, talked to Batman about them being similar and linked together, the story was tied to the larger corruption of the mob and exposing the scandal of the DA, which would have hurt the public's trust in him and damaged the big case that put away Maroni. Sounds kinda familiar. But it was at least done in some different ways. Joker was more terrorist with blowing up a hospital and the barges at the end. With the Riddler, his final plan didn't really make much sense. Unleashing crazy social media followers, blowing things up and flooding the city didn't seem to fit with the purpose of exposing lies and corruption, those things felt more like the Joker's chaos and terrorism from the Dark Knight. They built up all the psychological stuff and exposing corruption and then reduced to a big special effects spectacle. Felt kinda out of place. Unless it was meant as a "cleansing" or something, I don't recall if he mentioned that. I loved using Something in the Way by Nirvana, I thought it fit perfectly...but using it a 2nd time was too much. The majority of the movie is the score and then this song used twice. Could've used a different song the second time at the end. When he looked up the elrata whatever website while up in the skyscraper, he just happened to have the Bat-laptop with him that looked like a bullet proof case or something. How convenient. Batman using that awkward flying wings suit off the building felt like the old 80s movie. Didn't quite fit and came off a bit corny for the vibe of the rest of this. 2 hours ago, Bwestbrook36 said: Hide contents Do you think they did the riddler stuff to close to how Nolan did the joker scenes? Like using the media to draw Batman out of the shadows and to turn people of Gotham against him? I liked it but, it felt all the same in some ways. See my last post with complaints, ha ha same page.
March 7, 20224 yr 3 minutes ago, NOTW said: I enjoyed this, but some criticisms: Reveal hidden contents The riddles were mostly easy to figure out. The one toward the end with el rata, Batman figures it out but Gordon is completely clueless. A few seconds after Batman says it, Gordon repeats it like it's the hardest riddle ever and it makes him look dumb. I don't know if they were trying to suggest Batman is so smart and Gordon was impressed or what, but it made Gordon look dumb. They also didn't really explain why or how Bruce is the world's greatest detective. Alfred was back home cracking code and Batman was just good at guessing the riddles on the spot. Batman Begins showed how he learned to fight and study criminal behavior while he was away, we don't know here how exactly Bruce got detective skills. Also if he and Alfred are so smart and have been following all these clues, why would Alfred open the package that he should know is from the Riddler? You know he's targeting high profile people, he's already mentioned the Renewal project as a clue which Thomas Wayne started...so at least be safe about opening the package or wait for Bruce. I didn't like the ex machina type thing where Batman goes back to Riddler's apartment and the one cop guarding the door just happens to know what the carpet tool is because of his dad's job. For "the World's Greatest Detective" why didn't he research what the tool was himself? A quick google search would haven't answered that, or didn't anyone at the police lab study it to find out what it was? Not to mention the tow truck bed that lowers to make a ramp conveniently when he needs to jump over a tanker truck that is on fire. When comparing to the Joker in the Dark Knight there were too many similarities. The Joker targeted high profile figures in Gotham, left clues for Batman to solve, drew like-minded crazies to his cause, went "Saw" on someone by sewing a cell phone into their stomach, got caught on purpose as part of his larger plan, posted videos for the media to share, called for the unmasking of Batman, talked to Batman about them being similar and linked together, the story was tied to the larger corruption of the mob and exposing the scandal of the DA, which would have hurt the public's trust in him and damaged the big case that put away Maroni. Sounds kinda familiar. But it was at least done in some different ways. Joker was more terrorist with blowing up a hospital and the barges at the end. With the Riddler, his final plan didn't really make much sense. Unleashing crazy social media followers, blowing things up and flooding the city didn't seem to fit with the purpose of exposing lies and corruption, those things felt more like the Joker's chaos and terrorism from the Dark Knight. They built up all the psychological stuff and exposing corruption and then reduced to a big special effects spectacle. Felt kinda out of place. I loved using Something in the Way by Nirvana, I thought it fit perfectly...but using it a 2nd time was too much. The majority of the movie is the score and then this song used twice. Could've used a different song the second time at the end. Batman using that awkward flying wings suit off the building felt like the old 80s movie. Didn't quite fit and came off a bit corny for the vibe of the rest of this. See my last post with complaints, ha ha same page. I must of missed it lol
March 7, 20224 yr Just now, Bwestbrook36 said: I must of missed it lol I think you posted while I was typing it out.
March 7, 20224 yr I saw some comments on social media complaining it is "woke" and too much of an agenda. I didn't get that at all. There's literally 1 line about privilege and guess what? Bruce is privileged, he's wealthy. In Batman Returns the entire plot of Penguin's plan is about getting back at privileged rich people and taking their first born sons. And Catwoman was a feminist character fighting back against men who abused her. It was actually more woke in 1992 than any of the modern Batmans.
March 7, 20224 yr 2 hours ago, NOTW said: They better check on Paul Dano that he doesn't get tooooo into character. Told you he was giving ledger vibes!
March 8, 20224 yr I do know this will be one of the only physical movies I’ll have purchased over the past 5-7 years. Can’t wait to see some behind the scenes stuff, deleted scenes, etc.
March 9, 20224 yr Spoiler-Free Thoughts: I was way wrong about Zoe Kravitz. She was the best part of the movie and embodied all of Catwoman’s traits. IMO, Michelle Pfeiffer isn’t sexy enough and Anne Hathaway, although a good actress, was simply miscast. I’m surprised there aren’t more comments about pacing at the end of the movie. I thought the middle 70% was really good, but the ending drug on and brought down my entire memory of the movie. Jeffrey Wright was very good. I’d say he’s comparable to Gary Oldman in that role. Alfred was worse.
March 9, 20224 yr 19 minutes ago, SB52 said: Spoiler-Free Thoughts: I was way wrong about Zoe Kravitz. She was the best part of the movie and embodied all of Catwoman’s traits. IMO, Michelle Pfeiffer isn’t sexy enough and Anne Hathaway, although a good actress, was simply miscast. I’m surprised there aren’t more comments about pacing at the end of the movie. I thought the middle 70% was really good, but the ending drug on and brought down my entire memory of the movie. Jeffrey Wright was very good. I’d say he’s comparable to Gary Oldman in that role. Alfred was worse. I noted i thought the ending was out of place given the buildup.
March 9, 20224 yr 2 hours ago, NOTW said: I noted i thought the ending was out of place given the buildup. That probably where I started to get a little bored myself. To much darkness at a very slow pace lol.
March 9, 20224 yr 18 minutes ago, Bwestbrook36 said: That probably where I started to get a little bored myself. To much darkness at a very slow pace lol. I liked the darkness. But the events of the ending got out of place from what they were developing. See my previous post in spoilers.
March 9, 20224 yr 1 minute ago, NOTW said: I liked the darkness. But the events of the ending got out of place from what they were developing. See my previous post in spoilers. No!
March 10, 20224 yr Re, the ending: Do you guys not see how they needed the third act to go like it was to start his character development? Like when the Riddler follower said "I’m vengeance.” and Batman looked at him and and had the moment of realization.
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