EMB Blog: 2021 Regular and Post Season

[NCiggles]

5 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

Actually, under NV’s dram shop law, businesses are absolved of liability for serving alcohol to a person older than 21.  Only dram shop liability or social host liability comes from serving someone under 21.  The bar is not liable.   One should be able to further argue intervening cause in that he made the conscious decision to drive after drinking and further, a direct cause appears to be his speed.  

Never underestimate the Clark County plaintiff’s bar.  Identified as a judicial hellhole in the past by ATRF, Clark County is so scary that the MGM Grand and its insurers paid hundreds of millions settling the Las Vegas shooter case where over a series of days the shooter smuggled arms into the hotel in a golf bag.  The measure of liability is what would a reasonable and prudent hotel done that the MGM didn’t do in that situation. Las Vegas juries are prone to ignore facts and award extremely high verdicts.  

That said, that doesn’t mean that the bar won’t be sued and that the judge will hold off on granting a summary judgment to "encourage” the defendant to contribute to the settlement.  Happens all the time.   If the bar valet parked his vehicle and delivered it to him, visibly intoxicated or with knowledge of his alcohol consumption, the dram shop law may not protect it.  Like I said, creative lawyers can weave within the framework of the law.

Think about this, you NJ residents, the next time you host a get together for an Eagles game.  NJ is where social host liability got its start and a social host can be sued for serving a person alcohol when that person goes out and has an accident while DUI.  

I mean speeding wasn't the cause so much as an impaired reaction time that kept him from slowing down.  I don't think driving recklessly is ever not a foreseeable event of allowing someone to get too drunk.  Imposing liability on hosts and businesses has a positive impact on society.  It lessens DUIs and importantly fatal accidents as the result of DUIs.  While on occasion it may be unfair, if it makes bars for a little while in Nevada stop serving drunk patrons it will have a positive impact on society.  

[TorontoEagle]

Just now, bpac55 said:

I hope he plays safety.  Wallace has shown nothing.  I think Epps is a serviceable starter.  They need something, anything in the pipeline at safety.  

Maddox has played in over 60% of the snaps this year as the NCB.  His health issues in the past can be partially blamed on Andrew Sendejo.  He's been one of the more reliable and better defenders on the team this year.   On a defense that lacks so much talent, Maddox is one guy who has some.

I feel like Maddox is always in/out for minor injuries, with the only serious one the Sendejo debacle. But maybe that's just me. And certainly this year he has been healthy and playing well, no debate there. But, how much of that is motivated by a contract year? Or is he flourishing in what Gannon is asking as opposed to what Shorts was asking? I don't know honestly. 

I think @ManuManu made the comparison of slot corners to relievers in baseball. They have good years and bad years, and they seem hard to predict what you're gonna get. If Maddox wants to sign a team friendly deal, I'm all for it. If he wants market value or another team is going to pay him significantly more, I won't lose sleep if he walks out the door. 

 

[Connecticut Eagle]

3 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

I've read it's a deep CB draft. Anybody have other names to keep an eye on? 

A list I found on the world wide web...

1. Derek Stingley Jr., LSU
2. Kaiir Elam, Florida
3. Andrew Booth Jr., Clemson
4. Roger McCreary, Auburn
5. Trent McDuffie, Washington
6. Ahmad Gardner, Cincinnati
7. Mykael Wright, Oregon
8. Noah Daniels, TCU
9. Tiawan Mullen, Indiana
10a. Josh Jobe, Alabama
10b. Derion Kendrick, Georgia

[EaglePhan1986]

[TorontoEagle]

10 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

True but in this case the pain and suffering of dying by burning to death while trapped in her car can result in a significant pain and suffering award.  I also believe that lost wages can be recovered in the survival action. The likelihood of remittitur from the court or the appellate court in NV is highly unlikely.   Not much shocks their conscience. Add to that punitive damages, which are insurable in NV, and the verdict against Ruggs could be quite high. I suspect, even if his agent arranged an umbrella policy for him, that like mine, it has a punitive damages exclusion. 

The other thing to consider is his girlfriend's damages. Up here, if she got into the car with him and she knew he was impaired, her claim would be significantly reduced. 

3 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

A list I found on the world wide web...

1. Derek Stingley Jr., LSU
2. Kaiir Elam, Florida
3. Andrew Booth Jr., Clemson
4. Roger McCreary, Auburn
5. Trent McDuffie, Washington
6. Ahmad Gardner, Cincinnati
7. Mykael Wright, Oregon
8. Noah Daniels, TCU
9. Tiawan Mullen, Indiana
10a. Josh Jobe, Alabama
10b. Derion Kendrick, Georgia

What's this witch craft you speak of

[bpac55]

1 minute ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

A list I found on the world wide web...

1. Derek Stingley Jr., LSU
2. Kaiir Elam, Florida
3. Andrew Booth Jr., Clemson
4. Roger McCreary, Auburn
5. Trent McDuffie, Washington
6. Ahmad Gardner, Cincinnati
7. Mykael Wright, Oregon
8. Noah Daniels, TCU
9. Tiawan Mullen, Indiana
10a. Josh Jobe, Alabama
10b. Derion Kendrick, Georgia

Either of the Cincinnati CB would be great.  Coby Bryant is a good one too.

A name not on the list is Sevyn Banks.  He was a 1st round prospect in my mind but hurt his knee and hasn't played much this year.  Howie special in round 2.

[NCiggles]

3 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I hope he plays safety.  Wallace has shown nothing.  I think Epps is a serviceable starter.  They need something, anything in the pipeline at safety.  

Maddox has played in over 60% of the snaps this year as the NCB.  His health issues in the past can be partially blamed on Andrew Sendejo.  He's been one of the more reliable and better defenders on the team this year.   On a defense that lacks so much talent, Maddox is one guy who has some.

I like the way Epps has played.  I think Wallace has had a more mixed performance.  I think he would probably do better playing closer to the line and I don't know if he's cut out to be a deep safety.  I think Vincent did play safety at LSU and some scouting reports see him as a Free Safety vs. outside CB.  

[TorontoEagle]

1 minute ago, Bacarty2 said:

Again,  not true. 

Redskins job is better then the Jags,, Texans, Giants, Lions, and probably the Jets, and the way the dolphins are going maybe them too(although the women and weather would be nice). 

You also have to remember Daboll and Staley didnt even want to take an interview with our dumpster fire so you may be able to put us on  that list while Howie is still here. 

 

soooooo.... Life time Frat membership, top 10 defense, multi million dollar job and a hell of a lot better than a couple teams. 

So yea, keep digging deeper bud

 

Uhhh....they don't have that. They were over inflated by playing crappy QB's last year. I believe they are 29th in DVOA on defense this year. 

[bpac55]

4 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

I feel like Maddox is always in/out for minor injuries, with the only serious one the Sendejo debacle. But maybe that's just me. And certainly this year he has been healthy and playing well, no debate there. But, how much of that is motivated by a contract year? Or is he flourishing in what Gannon is asking as opposed to what Shorts was asking? I don't know honestly. 

I think @ManuManu made the comparison of slot corners to relievers in baseball. They have good years and bad years, and they seem hard to predict what you're gonna get. If Maddox wants to sign a team friendly deal, I'm all for it. If he wants market value or another team is going to pay him significantly more, I won't lose sleep if he walks out the door. 

 

I can see that mindset of having up and down years.  It's been a rotating door for some time now.  

[NCiggles]

4 minutes ago, Connecticut Eagle said:

A list I found on the world wide web...

1. Derek Stingley Jr., LSU
2. Kaiir Elam, Florida
3. Andrew Booth Jr., Clemson
4. Roger McCreary, Auburn
5. Trent McDuffie, Washington
6. Ahmad Gardner, Cincinnati
7. Mykael Wright, Oregon
8. Noah Daniels, TCU
9. Tiawan Mullen, Indiana
10a. Josh Jobe, Alabama
10b. Derion Kendrick, Georgia

You're the Al Gore of the EMB in terms of scouting players.  

[austinfan]

Teams usually carry 9-10 DBs on their roster, the fact that Howie was shopping Cox and Dillard says he doesn't see a wildcard this year as a realistic goal and is maneuvering for next season.

Why add Gowan and Vincent? My suspicion is they scouted these guys for the draft, liked what they saw but were concerned about the opt out year. Then they probably reviewed pre-season film of these guys, noted how they physically matured after missing a year, and how they progressed as players. It's very possible that they considered them better players than their 2021 draft slots. Especially if Gannon, who has been a DB coach, reviewed those players and felt they fit his scheme. So they were on the "wish list" of players to acquire if they shake free.

Vincent for example, needed to add strength (8 reps at 225), Gowan has outside CB size but probably needs a lot of work on technique.

McPhearson and McCain are both 5'11, so they are potential outside as well as nickel, or even a move to safety.

They also have Riley and Mayden on the PS.

Harris, Maddox and Nelson are UDFAs, the jury is still out on Epps and Wallace, so stocking up on low cost, athletic DBs is not a bad idea. All of the guys they added test well athletically.

The purpose of draft picks is to add talent, when you can use a 6th rd pick to add a player who is only 22 or 23 and for whom you have better information than a college player (b/c you have pre-season film against NFL talent in NFL schemes), why not? Draft picks, trades, waiver wire, when rebuilding you fill out the back of the roster and the PS with as many young athletes with upside as you can find. The open additions in the secondary started last season with guys like Jacquet, Arnold, etc.

Doesn't preclude adding a top player, but depth is always good.

[TorontoEagle]

2 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

Either of the Cincinnati CB would be great.  Coby Bryant is a good one too.

A name not on the list is Sevyn Banks.  He was a 1st round prospect in my mind but hurt his knee and hasn't played much this year.  Howie special in round 2.

What a name....

[NCiggles]

2 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

The other thing to consider is his girlfriend's damages. Up here, if she got into the car with him and she knew he was impaired, her claim would be significantly reduced. 

 

I think you're right and her damages would be reduced potentially by the percentage she's found to be at fault.  

[austinfan]

16 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I know you can't think like that and they had no idea where the pick would be.  I think 4th round picks still hold serious value.  Had they traded a 6th for Avery then we have no problem.  Howie decided to trade a 4th round pick for a guy who was taken in the 5th round and wasn't performing.  Avery had a decent rookie year but his play did not warrant trading a better pick than his original draft slot.

You're forgetting the draft discount.

My suspicion is Schwartz wanted Avery (he likes his fastballs) then couldn't figure out what to do with him as he moved away from the wide 9. I find it hard to believe Howie just goes out and trades (drafts) for players without talking to the coordinator/position coach to see if the player is a fit. We know Stoutland lobbies for players he likes, I suspect most coaches do.

Notice Avery has settled in as a SLB, sometimes it's the right player waiting for the right DC. Avery was always a better fit at LB (too short to be a DE).

Sometimes it's circumstances, I'm sure Gannon saw Kerrigan as a fit for his hybrid fronts, then Graham gets injured, Sweat isn't built for 50 snaps a game, so Kerrigan has to play with his hand on the ground and is struggling. Domino impact, which is why some injuries have a bigger impact, not just the lost of a player, but playing other players out of position.

[austinfan]

22 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

The future at CB comes down to what Gannon wants to run. If it’s zone heavy, we probably aren’t spending a high 1 on the player. If we want more man coverage, Stingley is in play and we’ll need a premium investment at the position. 

I think Gannon is zone oriented and you're right, we're probably more likely to draft a S high than a CB (1st rd), they can get solid zone CBs (good size, quickness over speed, good tackler and ball skills) in the 2nd and 3rd rds. But if you're gonna play zone and want to disguise your coverages, you need more speed at safety so you can go cover 1 without losing hair.

If the Eagles and Indy picks are in the middle of the first round, won't surprise me if Howie trades down with the Miami pick if there isn't a player they're absolutely in love with where they draft - because picking up extra 2nd and 3rd rd picks could allow them to rebuild the back seven in one draft while shoring up the OL. If you could add a DL, LB, S and CB in the first three rounds, that would go a long way in improving this defense.

[greend]

43 minutes ago, NCiggles said:

Who would have thought in a state where casinos and nightlife are big business the legislature wouldn't pass common sense dram shop laws to impose liability on those businesses? 

Sorry but, people should take responsibility for their own life. How would a casino/bar know whether or not any person was driving or riding with someone else? 

[BigEFly]

59 minutes ago, bpac55 said:

I agree that trading 6th/7th round picks for lottery tickets isn't a bad thing.  However, when he's trading and depending on those lottery tickets to fill weak spots we have a problem.  Not only weak spots, but weak spots he either fails to scout the right way or continually ignore in FA or early rounds of the draft.  it's bare minimum investment. 

Investing a 4th round pick in Genard Avery basically made him a roster lock, no matter how he performed.  That pick ended up being the 5th pick in the 4th round.  With the new layout and schedule of the NFL Draft, the top end of the 4th round has become more important because it's the 1st round of the 3rd day.  Teams are able to re-evaluate their boards and might be more willing to trade up if there's a player they want.  I also think drafting ahead of your division rivals is a big advantage.  By trading the 4th for Avery, it put the Eagles behind Dallas and NYG.  Dallas took Jabril Cox (who just tore his ACL), a player I think is going to be a steal in the 4th.  

I know I'm repeating myself here, but I really think Howie is going to say that using the resources of late round draft picks to bring in Josiah Scott and Kary Vincent as well as Ertz for Gowan is enough of an investment for him to ignore addressing CB either in FA or early in the draft.

If the Eagles were just looking for CB4 or CB5 then using late round picks on lottery tickets would be just fine.  I think Howie wants these lottery tickets to be starters.

I won’t champion Howie, but he now has picked up or drafted two of the CB2 candidates from 2021 (McPhearson and Gowan) and my favorite NCB candidate (Vincent) plus traded for a well projected NCB from 2020 (Scott).  Still want a CB1 to supplement and ultimately replace Slay in next year’s draft.   Just as this year was a deep draft at slot WR, it had depth at CB2/NCB.  

What position is CB4 and CB5?  Is that depth chart reference because that applies too.  Take a look around the league.  Most CBs are lottery tickets. It is also a position that high picks bust at all the time.  Gowan and Vincent are excellent examples of lottery tickets.  Both were green due to less experience and sitting out 2020 but go back and look at their film and you see real potential. Both are smooth athletes, reasonably fluid hips and showed talent when on the field.  Frankly, I thought when he played, Gowan was the best CB on UCF in 2019.  

Interesting pick up.  Somewhat unnoticed, the Eagles signed Jared Mayden to the PS.  Jeremiah liked him out of Alabama in the 2020 draft.  He signed as a UDFA with the 49ers.  Played S when he got to play at Alabama but word is they had him play all CB and S positions.  Good size and good speed.  Was on the 49ers PS last year and to start this year.   Eagles scooped in when the 49ers released him.  I do like that we are seeing churn on the PS this year. 

[TorontoEagle]

5 minutes ago, greend said:

Sorry but, people should take responsibility for their own life. How would a casino/bar know whether or not any person was driving or riding with someone else? 

Any establishment that is licensed to serve alcohol has a duty of care that they must uphold. (I'm speaking in terms of Ontario law). Hell, even you hosting a party where you serve alcohol, you can and will be dragged into a lawsuit if something similar happens. That duty of care is in place to have servers identify people who are drunk, not over serve them (though this happens often) but most importantly not allow them to drive away while impaired. Our servers must complete a "SmartServe" program before they can serve drinks, and this is covered at length in it. 

 

[NCiggles]

10 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Teams usually carry 9-10 DBs on their roster, the fact that Howie was shopping Cox and Dillard says he doesn't see a wildcard this year as a realistic goal and is maneuvering for next season.

Why add Gowan and Vincent? My suspicion is they scouted these guys for the draft, liked what they saw but were concerned about the opt out year. Then they probably reviewed pre-season film of these guys, noted how they physically matured after missing a year, and how they progressed as players. It's very possible that they considered them better players than their 2021 draft slots. Especially if Gannon, who has been a DB coach, reviewed those players and felt they fit his scheme. So they were on the "wish list" of players to acquire if they shake free.

Vincent for example, needed to add strength (8 reps at 225), Gowan has outside CB size but probably needs a lot of work on technique.

McPhearson and McCain are both 5'11, so they are potential outside as well as nickel, or even a move to safety.

They also have Riley and Mayden on the PS.

Harris, Maddox and Nelson are UDFAs, the jury is still out on Epps and Wallace, so stocking up on low cost, athletic DBs is not a bad idea. All of the guys they added test well athletically.

The purpose of draft picks is to add talent, when you can use a 6th rd pick to add a player who is only 22 or 23 and for whom you have better information than a college player (b/c you have pre-season film against NFL talent in NFL schemes), why not? Draft picks, trades, waiver wire, when rebuilding you fill out the back of the roster and the PS with as many young athletes with upside as you can find. The open additions in the secondary started last season with guys like Jacquet, Arnold, etc.

Doesn't preclude adding a top player, but depth is always good.

Given where they are going to find themselves in the draft, I would have to think the Eagles will consider taking a CB early in the draft.  I think it's one of the deepest positions but that could very well change.  A lot of draft rankings have 3 CBs in the top 10 of the draft, Stingley, Booth and Elam.  It's definitely a position Howie and the Eagles tend to prioritize.  I think the Eagles will try to keep Maddox.  I think he's not going to get some large deal from another team even with a strong year in the slot.   Nelson is likely to be gone absent some team friendly deal for next season.  I think it's possible they could consider trading Slay despite incurring like $15 million in a dead cap hit because it would save them about $6 million still in cap space.  It's not a great FA CB class and teams that are contenders would likely consider trading for him.  The Eagles didn't seem bothered about the cap hit for trading Cox if they got a decent return.  The cap hit for Slay is easier.  

[TorontoEagle]

Just now, 4for4EaglesNest said:

But as we all know, even if a person doesn't appear drunk, he/she could still be a danger behind the wheel.  Way too much grey area for anything to hold up.  

Each case must stand on it's own merits. Bartenders/servers will be interviewed and have to give statements. Civil law is all about grey areas, and host liability holds up well enough up here anyway. If the host is found just 1% liable, their entire coverage is accessible. Usually starts around $2 million for any bar. Now, they would only be obligated to pay to the degree they are found negligent, but, as often happens, the drunk idiot doesn't have the money to cover the damages awarded (or doesn't even have insurance at all) and so the bar is obligated to cover it. 

[greend]

5 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

Any establishment that is licensed to serve alcohol has a duty of care that they must uphold. (I'm speaking in terms of Ontario law). Hell, even you hosting a party where you serve alcohol, you can and will be dragged into a lawsuit if something similar happens. That duty of care is in place to have servers identify people who are drunk, not over serve them (though this happens often) but most importantly not allow them to drive away while impaired. Our servers must complete a "SmartServe" program before they can serve drinks, and this is covered at length in it. 

 

Hosting a party is actually way less difficult to know when drunks are driving. My point is you need to take responsibility for your self. 

[TorontoEagle]

Just now, greend said:

Hosting a party is actually way less difficult to know when drunks are driving. My point is you need to take responsibility for your self. 

For sure it is. And I agree with you, people need to be more responsible for themselves. But, history has shown that people aren't able to do that. So, the idea is you make more people responsible and it hopefully curtails some of it. It will never fully go away, because people love to drink and drive for some reason. 

[Swoop]

1 hour ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Wait, you categorize another poster, that you don't know on a message board, as a "Pillar"?  You know this is just a message board right?  You and your other "pillars", like the ones who liked this feeble attempt at a high-brow insult, take this place way too seriously.  Again.....IT'S A MESSAGE BOARD.  It's funny that I am called an old man by some morons and then someone who "was in diapers back when the EMB started by others".    I guarantee you I have been on the EMB (either this iteration or the old version) as long or if not longer than you and AFan.  

This comes to mind when thinking about you and your "pillars".  

- "A man is judged by the company he keeps and the company is judged by the men it keeps"

Zip it old timer!

[MillerTime]

 

[NCiggles]

2 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

But as we all know, even if a person doesn't appear drunk, he/she could still be a danger behind the wheel.  Way too much grey area for anything to hold up.  

I mean there's literal receipts for what they consumed. Dram shop liability in NC is similar to Nevada.  Typically the get around is proving they served alcohol to someone who was visibly drunk. It's a negligence claim similar to dram shop liability but there's an additional element to prove.   Ultimately you just need evidence to get past a summary judgment and potentially to a jury. Civil lawsuits have essentially 3 phases prior to a verdict: 1) Filing a Complaint, 2) Discovery (this includes deposition of witnesses and finding evidence like videos from the bar), 3) Trial.  A summary judgment motion comes after the discovery phase but prior to trial, if a defendant wins on that issue the suit is done. It would mean there's no evidence sufficient to support a claim the suit is over for the plaintiffs.   Typically defendants won't make a serious offer to settle a case where there's a significant gray area of liability until a judge rules on summary judgment motion.   So if you have a credible witness or clear video + receipts that show someone is visibly drunk when the server got him more alcohol, you can get far enough to potentially win a jury verdict against the establishment.