1 hour ago, Original Sin said:

Jeremy Schaap

 

@JeremySchaap

 

 

To reiterate, 44 qbs have gone first, second or third overall in the last 50 NFL drafts, and exactly two--Aikman and Peyton--have won Super Bowls starting for the teams that drafted them. That makes selecting qbs up high exceptionally risky

Meh.  The Elway and Eli Manning picks were known to be trades and both played their entire careers for the same team so that shades this a bit as do all the wins by Brady.  Football is a team sport too so the quality of the overall team impacts this stat as well.

 Mahommes didn’t lose the Super Bowl this year.  As you said, Tampa was more balanced. Andy has been getting away with bandaids at CB for a couple of years and his pass rush failing and losing two OTs plus having his best G sitting out the season had as much impact on the outcome as did either QB.  David won the Super Bowl. Without viable options at OT, the Tampa rush was able to get pressure on Mahommes and David’s coverage on Kelce was superb.  

54 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

Driscoll is gonna be good. Not just a notch above mediocre.

I wonder if Driscoll’s build supports getting that backend strength he lacks. If he is a viable back up at RT and G, that would be great.

1 minute ago, BigEFly said:

Meh.  The Elway and Eli Manning picks were known to be trades and both played their entire careers for the same team so that shades this a bit as do all the wins by Brady.  Football is a team sport too so the quality of the overall team impacts this stat as well.

 Mahommes didn’t lose the Super Bowl this year.  As you said, Tampa was more balanced. Andy has been getting away with bandaids at CB for a couple of years and his pass rush failing and losing two OTs plus having his best G sitting out the season had as much impact on the outcome as did either QB.  David won the Super Bowl. Without viable options at OT, the Tampa rush was able to get pressure on Mahommes and David’s coverage on Kelce was superb.  

KC did absolutely nothing good in the Super Bowl , they were beat thoroughly in every phase of the game , not just OL

most balanced team in the NFL won .

34 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Eagles are rebuilding, that means you don't really care what a player can do in 2021, rather, whether that player is a potential building block for 2023 and forward.

The next two years are about adding and developing talent, not winning, winning will be a byproduct of successful player development.

So the draft board should reflect that reality, and Howie should "Trust the Board."

Rebuilding doesn’t mean not caring at all what a player can do in 2021.  Lack of development would e a significant issue.   The team doesn’t want to not be competitive at all.  A successful franchise needs to e looking two years down the road at all times. 

Dan Orlovsky

 

@danorlovsky7

 

 

Playing QB is about "surviving”-than-“thriving”. Every QB does those 2 things differently-for less athletic QB-getting to 2/3/4 CONSISTENTLY in progression is NEEDED for both. For an athletic QB—they can "survive” & "thrive” w/o NEEDING to get to 2/3/4 as consistently bc of legs

7 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

KC did absolutely nothing good in the Super Bowl , they were beat thoroughly in every phase of the game , not just OL

most balanced team in the NFL won .

I said that, just a different way than you did.  IMHO, Brady wasn’t the MVP, David was. 

31 minutes ago, Utebird said:

I think a lot of it isn't just that guys don't work hard or lazy it's just in college a lot of these kids especially if they are from smaller schools don't have the resources to get in super football shape 

Once in the NFL they have access to fitness trainers and health nutritionists and top notch training facilities and rehab and recovery and far more means knowledge time and access to really get ripped.

I think there was a report that herbig had lost some weight last year and I'd assume the coaches would encourage to slim down even more.

I like herbigs game he just needs to change his body composition to be a more functional mover as an OL be interesting to see if he can.

Too much cardio is useless anyway.

Well, that and steroids help.

1 hour ago, TEW said:

John Elway?

Drafted by the Colts.

2 minutes ago, BigEFly said:

I said that, just a different way than you did.  IMHO, Brady wasn’t the MVP, David was. 

Devin  White should have got it led team in Ts tfl , had a int , and help shut down the middle of the field , white played well too , as did Suh , SMB , but my nod goes to White

49 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

It's silly to say that adding Pitts wouldn't even budge the needle for them.  Of course he makes that team better.  He makes an already really good offense all the better. That's like saying the Nets adding James Harden doesn't move the needle because they can already score with Durant and Kyrie but Harden does nothing to help their bad defense.  

They don't have any sort of threat at TE right now.  Pitts could end up being an all time great with his potential at that position.  Think of it from an Eagles perspective.  How are we going to be able to defense that offense with Pitts in there?  

We already can’t stop that offense, we can only hope to outscore them.

Welcome to 2021 football.

54 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Then why did Howie sign an old backup QB?

Because even when you're developing a team, you want to be competitive, really bad teams have a tendency to be bad forever, because it's not a conducive environment for player development.

50 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

It's silly to say that adding Pitts wouldn't even budge the needle for them.  Of course he makes that team better.  He makes an already really good offense all the better. That's like saying the Nets adding James Harden doesn't move the needle because they can already score with Durant and Kyrie but Harden does nothing to help their bad defense.  

They don't have any sort of threat at TE right now.  Pitts could end up being an all time great with his potential at that position.  Think of it from an Eagles perspective.  How are we going to be able to defense that offense with Pitts in there?  

#1: Comparing adding Harden to adding Pitts is hyperbole.  You know why. 

#2 Eagles perspective: have strong defensive line pressuring and hitting the QB.  Strong offensive line to dominate their weak defense.

16 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Well, that and steroids help.

Well yeah, I'm not sure how much steroids guys use anymore seems more like an 80s90s thing but I'm sure there are plenty of guys that use HGH and the advancement in health nutrition supplements in the last say 10 years has really exploded.

 

14 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

We already can’t stop that offense, we can only hope to outscore them.

Welcome to 2021 football.

 

Good luck outscoring them when they have Pitts.  Cowboys getting Pitts is not a good outcome.  Unfortunately since Howie traded back we are very likely to see both the Cowboys and Giants draft a player better than us in the 1st.  

8 minutes ago, Freshmilk said:

#1: Comparing adding Harden to adding Pitts is hyperbole.  You know why. 

#2 Eagles perspective: have strong defensive line pressuring and hitting the QB.  Strong offensive line to dominate their weak defense.

 

Pitts is going to have the potential to have a chance to develop into the best TE in the league fairly early into his career.  An All-Pro by year two or three of his career.  

 

How strong is the Eagles defensive line right now?  Fletcher is great but he is 30 and will be turning 31 by the end of the season.  Graham is really good and coming off of a really good year but he just turned 33 and we have to be realistic to the likely fact that we just saw the best of Brandon Graham and it will be down from here but hopefully a slow gradual down from here.  Besides that what exactly do we have along the defensive line?  I like Barnett but he can't stay healthy and I think it's holding him back from really taking that necessary next step forward given where he was drafted at.  Josh Sweat?  I think what he showed last year is that hopefully he can be a quality pass rushing rotational defensive end but that knee is a ticking time bomb.  Then we have Hargrave who looked like an awful signing all year then flashed a little bit 3 quarters into the season and then kind of disappeared again so who really knows what we have in him.  

 

In order for our defensive line to be a strong defensive line we are going to need pretty much everyone to remain healthy as well as Barnett and/or Sweat taking a big leap forward.  

 

42 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

KC did absolutely nothing good in the Super Bowl , they were beat thoroughly in every phase of the game , not just OL

most balanced team in the NFL won .

Yes Tampa had a balanced stacked team and KC was playing with out majority of it's starting OL.

Games are won in the trenches and the combination of tampa having a really good DL and the KC OL being hampered by injury was too much to over come. Not to mention Mahomes was also hobbled.

6 minutes ago, Utebird said:

Yes Tampa had a balanced stacked team and KC was playing with out majority of it's starting OL.

Games are won in the trenches and the combination of tampa having a really good DL and the KC OL being hampered by injury was too much to over come. Not to mention Mahomes was also hobbled.

Like I said , Bucs were down starting RG and had a rookie RT 

brady had a bum knee , had to have surgery after super bowl , and Mahomes wasn’t that hobbled, he ran for 498 yards scrambling 

all teams get injuries , that is why you have such a large roster 

depth is important come end of the year

look at eagles super bowl , they were really banged up , but they over came 

23 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Because even when you're developing a team, you want to be competitive, really bad teams have a tendency to be bad forever, because it's not a conducive environment for player development.

So the Eagles do care about winning or having good players on the field in 2021?

5 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

By the end, Fulgham couldn’t even run clear out routes because he couldn’t get off the LOS and ran terrible routes that picked his own teammates on screens. 

He was a puddle of mud on the field. 

 

The Eagles are likely looking at 3 first round picks next year.

They also have an almost unusable 11 draft picks this year.  The more darts theory only applies to players that aren’t immediately getting cut out of camp.  They cut multiple picks last year and will do so again this year if they don’t consolidate.

I’d like to see them trade up into late round 1 with their early 2 and some combination of their mid round glut of picks (this particular draft has some interesting edge value in that range).  Then, when the time comes, they should trade next year’s 2nd (and whatever change is necessary) for a 2023 first.

That gives them 3 consecutive drafts with multiple 1’s and a total of 7 first round picks in 3 years...which also gives you a total of 7 extra years of cap control of theoretically high end players.  That’s a huge foundation for a rebuilding team.

1 hour ago, austinfan said:

It's a bit skewed by Brady. Take him out of the equation and dominance by HOF types is not a given.

It’s not skewed by Brady at all. Put Brady aside and who else has won SBs over the last 20 years? Mahommes, Peyton Manning, Wilson, Rodgers, Brees, Roethlisberger, Eli Manning. The only guys that won’t get a gold jacket during that period are Brad Johnson and Nick Foles.
 

In the 90’s 8 of 10 Super Bowls were won by HOFers. In the 70’s literally every SB winning QB is in the HOF.

The 80’s were the outlier, and if Plunkett makes the HOF then that decade would switch over as well.

Super Bowls are overwhelmingly dominated by HOF QBs. This is an objective statistical fact.

1 minute ago, Original Sin said:

Like I said , Bucs were down starting RG and had a rookie RT 

depth is important come end of the year

look at eagles super bowl , they were really banged up , but they over came 

A rookie RT that had played the whole season.

Continuity is key.

I realize your a bucs fan which is still odd but hey to each their own and I think most would agree KC wasnt at full capacity in that super bowl and as such were at a distinct disadvantage from the get go and had an up hill battle not to mention what Reid was going through again with his son and a coach getting a dui.

Might seem like a small thing but I go back to the falcons super bowl in 98.

Their starting safety and team captain gets busted by an under cover cop for soliciting prostitution and it threw the whole team off and they didn't have a ton of injuries including to their starting qb like KC do to over come 

Sure they sound like excuses and now body on the chiefs is going to use them as such but come on now let's not pretend the bucs were some other worldly team and that KC didn't have a lot going against them.

If KC is healthy and without off field distractions id bet 9 times out of 10 KC wins that game.

And you would lose  quite a few of those 9 out of 10

kc scored 1 TD in 6 quarters against Tampa , going back the their regular season game , second half , and 4 super bowl quarters 

its save to say , Bowles figured something out , along with team growing on offense ,  first year QB 

But I’m moving on , that was last year and it’s over and done

3 minutes ago, TEW said:

It’s not skewed by Brady at all. Put Brady aside and who else has won SBs over the last 20 years? Mahommes, Peyton Manning, Wilson, Rodgers, Brees, Roethlisberger, Eli Manning. The only guys that won’t get a gold jacket during that period are Brad Johnson and Nick Foles.
 

In the 90’s 8 of 10 Super Bowls were won by HOFers. In the 70’s literally every SB winning QB is in the HOF.

The 80’s were the outlier, and if Plunkett makes the HOF then that decade would switch over as well.

Super Bowls are overwhelmingly dominated by HOF QBs. This is an objective statistical fact.

Flacco won one as well. Manning won a SB in Denver playing the worst football of his career. Wilson won a SB in his second season being carried by his defense (since he has subsequently risen to HOF status, he hasn’t even come close). Eli Manning has no business being mentioned in the HOF but for the very super bowl wins that we are talking about.

Your point still stands but there are enough exceptions to feel okay going with who you have at QB and building the best team you can. Especially now that the transition from college quarterbacking to pro quarterbacking has become streamlined with most NFL teams running College (spread) offenses.