9 hours ago, downundermike said:

@Outlaw you wanna take this or should I ? 

 

I don't see it.  He doesn't play against top competition, I don't see him getting that much separation.  He can make some nice catches but nothing he does seems all that remarkable.  He could be an unspectacular #2 or #3 WR. 

1 minute ago, DeathByEagle said:

We will see if there is truth to this with Nick and his play calling. Or if the FO learned from the mistakes they made if it was true. 

Nick in a lot of Colts interviews mentions you build through the run game. The pass game has success with a good run game being established. Watching the Colts offense you see that. If Nick is passing 70+ % of the time in Philly then you know the FO has their nose in it because it goes in the complete oppt direction Nick has been use to and has claimed out of his mouth what brings success in the scheme he believes in. 

In the end there is nothing we can do as fans if it is the case. People can say well fans need to not go to the games, stop buying merch etc. Well as a season ticket holder I can not just not pay for my tickets. I will lose them and the wait list is about 75 years long so there is someone next in line waiting for some moron to stop paying for his tickets.

We just have to hope that if this was the case that the FO learns from the mistakes they have made sooner then later. 

They knew exactly what they were getting with Sirianni, they knew Reich, they interviewed Siri for two days.

So if Lowie are adamant about establishing an AR type run/pass ratio as the MO, they hired the wrong guy.

Which is why I'm a bit skeptical of some of the stuff being reported, Pederson was a AR clone, AR and Holmgren are the only HCs he's spent a lot of time with in the NFL. Suddenly he's a run oriented coach who has to be pushed to pass the ball more? And Lowie pressured him into 4 deep routes last year?

4 minutes ago, austinfan said:

Rhodes was a fiery speaker, so what?

The fantasy of the HC going into the locker room and giving great speeches is really a college motif, firing up 19 year old kids. When you're dealing with 30 year old professionals, that shtick wears thin.

Most important thing a HC does is be a good administrator, that is, hire good coordinators and assistant coaches and work with them to improve your team and develop game plans. A HC who wants to spend most of his time as a OC/DC should stay a coordinator.

I like the Johnson hiring, but he's a half dozen years or more from HC status, first prove himself as a QB coach at the NFL level, then get promoted to OC, then if your offense is a top group for a few years, you'll be in the running for a HC job.

 

Everytime Sirianni speaks it seems like he is trying to fire up a group of 19 year olds. 

22 minutes ago, philafan4o8 said:

Looks like we were blaming Doug Pederson for not running the ball but the athletic article blew this story wide open. Wow. It is worse than I thought in that front office...

Right, and I'm wondering about Lurie's impact on game planning in the future.

The real question is why --

If it's because Lurie thinks he's smarter than everyone else he will insist on running the offense the way he wants.  We believe Siri is going to install an RPO / running first offense, but Lurie might push back at that.  We'll get a new head coach running the strange odd plays we've been complaining about for years.

If it's because Lurie did not like or respect Pederson, then we will see something very different.  

Stay tuned!

Everyone complaining yesterday about off topic subjects , more football they said , now nothing 

3 minutes ago, Original Sin said:

Everyone complaining yesterday about off topic subjects , more football they said , now nothing 

People just re-hashing the same criticisms of Lowie over and over. If you wait a few minutes, there'll inevitably be somebody complaining about Jefferson and Metcalf. And on and on it goes....

What are your thoughts on Shaun Wade? A lot of mocks I see have him going in the 3rd round? His stock seems to have fallen significantly, but I could see him as a Minkah-lite type of player. 

25 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

I don't see it.  He doesn't play against top competition, I don't see him getting that much separation.  He can make some nice catches but nothing he does seems all that remarkable.  He could be an unspectacular #2 or #3 WR. 

Donte Moncrief?

Saw this story today, additional information on the Lurie demands to fire Reich after 2016.  Wentz intervened.  Without his support, it seems likely that Schwartz would have been promoted and Doug and Frank would both have been gone.

https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/philadelphia-eagles-jeffrey-lurie-carson-wentz-20210413.html

8 minutes ago, TorontoEagle said:

People just re-hashing the same criticisms of Lowie over and over. If you wait a few minutes, there'll inevitably be somebody complaining about Jefferson and Metcalf. And on and on it goes....

What are your thoughts on Shaun Wade? A lot of mocks I see have him going in the 3rd round? His stock seems to have fallen significantly, but I could see him as a Minkah-lite type of player. 

3rd seems right , if not later  .  He absolutely killed his draft stock  with his play this year , he looked like a lock for the first rd 2 years ago , so the talent is apparently there .

12 hours ago, hputenis said:

 

 

Lol guess he's not coming back

One thing that occurred to me as I read the Athletic piece was that Lurie may have been trying to understand Doug's thinking rather than challenge it. As we rehash games, we're always questioning play calls but we don't know what has gone into them. Was a particular player hurt at a certain point so that the plays we planned to run for him or behind his block were not there? You can script all the plays you want but the script goes out the window pretty early on. The great military strategist, Moltke, famously said, "No battle plan survives first contact with the enemy."

So is Howie maybe not the issue here? Wonder if he would be as paranoid, etc under a different owner

33 minutes ago, John_C said:

Saw this story today, additional information on the Lurie demands to fire Reich after 2016.  Wentz intervened.  Without his support, it seems likely that Schwartz would have been promoted and Doug and Frank would both have been gone.

https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/philadelphia-eagles-jeffrey-lurie-carson-wentz-20210413.html

So ...... by this logic we can assume that Lurie wanted to hire Josh McDaniels, but the rookie QB (Hurts) intervened and Sirianni, Gannon, and Steichen were hired instead?

Wow, thanks Jalen!

3 minutes ago, Alphagrand said:

So ...... by this logic we can assume that Lurie wanted to hire Josh McDaniels, but the rookie QB (Hurts) intervened and Sirianni, Gannon, and Steichen were hired instead?

Wow, thanks Jalen!

If it's coming from Marcus Hayes, it's BS.

2 hours ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Man.  I should have copied and saved my posts slamming Lurie last offseason and the subsequent defense responses that came right back at me.  Sure seems like his defenders have gotten quiet.  It's almost like when I started the Howie sucks campaign a few years ago and now look at all of us all agreeing together.  I wonder what topic I'll have to spike the football on this time next year.  My gut is Devonte Smith.   

In 2023, it'll be Brian Johnson, I'll be able to come back and say "I told you so".  Because he'll be gone as a HC somewhere else and we'll be stuck with NS for another year.  

You might be the most consistently miserable poster in the boards. Congrats!

47 minutes ago, justrelax said:

If it's coming from Marcus Hayes, it's BS.

Seriously don't understand how that moron has a job. Who consistently reads that nonsense?

3 minutes ago, Saltpeter said:

Seriously don't understand how that moron has a job. Who consistently reads that nonsense?

 

He thinks he's a wordsmith but he can't even get through the first sentence without messing up his grammar.

1 hour ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

Everytime Sirianni speaks it seems like he is trying to fire up a group of 19 year olds. 

Well, he is dealing with Philly sports journalists...

28 minutes ago, justrelax said:

One thing that occurred to me as I read the Athletic piece was that Lurie may have been trying to understand Doug's thinking rather than challenge it. As we rehash games, we're always questioning play calls but we don't know what has gone into them. Was a particular player hurt at a certain point so that the plays we planned to run for him or behind his block were not there? You can script all the plays you want but the script goes out the window pretty early on. The great military strategist, Moltke, famously said, "No battle plan survives first contact with the enemy."

That’s what I was thinking. The language of the article was transparently designed to stir the pot and gain clicks, so I feel as if you have to take the report and interpret the news at a base level for yourself.

So you have an owner and analytics team going over the decision making in a game, trying to understand deviations from the analytics prescribed play call.

Frankly, this seems like something you would want to do. My only concern is how much time of the HC you are consuming. But you do want "after action” reports. You want to constantly evaluate the decision making. That is normal. If it’s as combative as the article reported, then that’s a problem, but i have to imagine that was more the framing of the writer than how it actually went down.

33 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

You might be the most consistently miserable poster in the boards. Congrats!

He's not even runner up to the most miserable poster here. 

11 minutes ago, TEW said:

That’s what I was thinking. The language of the article was transparently designed to stir the pot and gain clicks, so I feel as if you have to take the report and interpret the news at a base level for yourself.

So you have an owner and analytics team going over the decision making in a game, trying to understand deviations from the analytics prescribed play call.

Frankly, this seems like something you would want to do. My only concern is how much time of the HC you are consuming. But you do want "after action” reports. You want to constantly evaluate the decision making. That is normal. If it’s as combative as the article reported, then that’s a problem, but i have to imagine that was more the framing of the writer than how it actually went down.

I think Lurie should not have been part of those types of meetings. That responsibility should be deferred to Howie to vet the information. That extra layer of separation is necessary for chain of command health. If Howie senses an issue, I can see Lurie stepping in and seeking clarification, but that should be an uncommon practice...again for a healthy organization...Lurie got too close in the day-to-day and it has burned the organization. Hopefully they have learned from all the dysfunction that has been caused and there are more appropriate boundaries moving forward.

 

14 minutes ago, TEW said:

So you have an owner and analytics team going over the decision making in a game, trying to understand deviations from the analytics prescribed play call.

Frankly, this seems like something you would want to do. 

Absolutely not.  Game calling and flow is fluid, and based on previous play result.  You can not grill a coach and ask why on the 4th play of the 3rd series did you run, when we predicted through our analytics model that you should pass on that play.

If you are running the ball successfully, and the other team can't stop it, the analytics people can pound sand.

10 minutes ago, TEW said:

That’s what I was thinking. The language of the article was transparently designed to stir the pot and gain clicks, so I feel as if you have to take the report and interpret the news at a base level for yourself.

So you have an owner and analytics team going over the decision making in a game, trying to understand deviations from the analytics prescribed play call.

Frankly, this seems like something you would want to do. My only concern is how much time of the HC you are consuming. But you do want "after action” reports. You want to constantly evaluate the decision making. That is normal. If it’s as combative as the article reported, then that’s a problem, but i have to imagine that was more the framing of the writer than how it actually went down.

This is my take as well.  I don't think Doug was getting grilled over decision making.  I mean Pederson retained play calling control until last season.  He had control of day to day decisions.  I do think his firing has made some ill will surface and put those meetings in a different light.  

I think the article does hit on an important dynamic of the structure of the organization that is problematic.   Howie wants everyone to be accountable to him.  This creates a dynamic where analytics folks are seen as having the same authority as the head coach. I think that's ultimately a unworkable dynamic. Analytics people should be worked under the umbrella of the head coach to the extent they are analyzing the team's game performance/decision making of the coaches.  If they sit outside of the coaching tree they don't serve to inform anyone other than the GM and owner. The head coach is never going to see them as part of his staff.  Certainly he is going to be skeptical of the information they provide and so will his assistants.  

5 minutes ago, downundermike said:

Absolutely not.  Game calling and flow is fluid, and based on previous play result.  You can not grill a coach and ask why on the 4th play of the 3rd series did you run, when we predicted through our analytics model that you should pass on that play.

If you are running the ball successfully, and the other team can't stop it, the analytics people can pound sand.

You absolutely can and should. If the coach responds that the other team can’t stop the run, then that’s your answer. 

2 minutes ago, TEW said:

You absolutely can and should. If the coach responds that the other team can’t stop the run, then that’s your answer. 

I mean that's why teams look at their game film to analyze decision making.  Using analytics is just another way to analyze the game film.