Just now, eagle45 said:

What starting qbs in the entire nfl are both less talented (arm talent) as passers AND less polished as passers than Jalen Hurts?

Lets list them.

 

What is arm talent to you?  Then I can list your QBs.  

Waddle got an elite grade from Jacksonville. 

1 minute ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

What is arm talent to you?  Then I can list your QBs.  

Fair question, since that’s an ill-defined term.  Let’s move past arm talent and call it passing talent.

Height, arm strength, flickability (the physical part of the release to get the ball out), making all throws with desired velocity, ability to make off balance throws with velocity and accuracy.  
 

Polish being accuracy, the mental part of the release/trigger, reading the defense at the LOS pre-snap, seeing all progressions post snap, pocket presence, ball security, hitting guys in stride, etc.

 

What starting qbs in the nfl are worse in both departments?

 

22 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

Oh okay, so you list all these things that determine what you call arm talent but when questioned on those things that you listed you can't actually articulate what he is lacking in those areas.  Again I somehow forgot for the second time today that when talking with you I have to remember that I am talking to someone of very limited mental capabilities who isn't able to actually articulate and defend their opinions.  

I explained to you, imo, what arm talent meant. I explained to you 100 times that I don’t think Hurts has good arm talent because if he did he’d have a much higher completion percentage and wouldn’t have been benched for Tua in the most important game of his life. You’re allowed to disagree, as am I with you. 
 

If I’m not up to your level of intelligence, by all means, block me. You wouldn’t be the only one. 
 

And one last thing... Nick Foles is the only Eagles Super Bowl MVP ever and you wanted him benched for Sudfeld. 

8 minutes ago, eagle45 said:

Fair question, since that’s an ill-defined term.  Let’s move past arm talent and call it passing talent.

Height, arm strength, flickability (the physical part of the release to get the ball out), making all throws with desired velocity, ability to make off balance throws with velocity and accuracy.  
 

Polish being accuracy, the mental part of the release/trigger, reading the defense at the LOS pre-snap, seeing all progressions post snap, pocket presence, ball security, hitting guys in stride, etc.

 

What starting qbs in the nfl are worse in both departments?

 

For how you define as raw passing talent, I would say the only QBs that he would he really falls behind are: Rodgers, Allen, Wentz, Stafford, Herbert, Mahomes and probably a touch of a weaker arm than Wilson.

 

As for polish he's only entering his 2nd year in the NFL and is 22 years old.  Rarely any QBs just entering the league are what I would consider polished passers.  That will come with time with his development.  

 

2 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

For how you define as raw passing talent, I would say the only QBs that he would he really falls behind are: Rodgers, Allen, Wentz, Stafford, Herbert, Mahomes and probably a touch of a weaker arm than Wilson.

 

As for polish he's only entering his 2nd year in the NFL and is 22 years old.  Rarely any QBs just entering the league are what I would consider polished passers.  That will come with time with his development.  

 

Not who he falls behind.  I want to know who falls behind him in both categories. 
 

Becoming a polished qb does not always come with time.  It’s hard and it’s the reason most qbs wash out.  Some rookies/prospects/young pro qbs are better in that area than others.  Not every rookie qb automatically grades the same in that department...

Just now, EaglePhan1986 said:

I explained to you, imo, what arm talent meant. I explained to you 100 times that I don’t think Hurts has good arm talent because if he did he’d have a much higher completion percentage and wouldn’t have been benched for Tua in the most important game of his life. You’re allowed to disagree, as am I with you. 
 

If I’m not up to your level of intelligence, by all means, block me. You wouldn’t be the only one. 
 

And one last thing... Nick Foles is the only Eagles Super Bowl MVP ever and you wanted him benched for Sudfeld. 

 

You explained what arm talent is by listing several things which you say make up arm talent and then when I asked you to break down the specific things that you cited as arm talent in regards to Hurts you flat out couldn't and at first acted like you never even listed those things.

 

 

Just now, eagle45 said:

Not who he falls behind.  I want to know who falls behind him in both categories. 

 

I think arm talent wise by your definition he is certainly on the same level as everyone else that I did not list.   Although his ability to make throws off balance and on the run certainly puts him above some of the most non-mobile QBs in the league.  

I don't get all the back and forth on Hurts. I rather watch him than Flaco...god I rather watch a cowboys game than that 😳

25 minutes ago, ManuManu said:

Waddle got an elite grade from Jacksonville. 

The Jags just signed Tebow. Their opinion means very little 

So since everyone is already writing Hurts off who would be worth trading for or trading up to #1 for in the draft?

1 minute ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Just logged in for the first time in a bit so had to fan the flames

5 minutes ago, RememberTheKoy said:

 

You explained what arm talent is by listing several things which you say make up arm talent and then when I asked you to break down the specific things that you cited as arm talent in regards to Hurts you flat out couldn't and at first acted like you never even listed those things.

 

 

Accuracy is huge. He doesn’t have it. Not yet anyway. I only needed one trait to breakdown. I don’t get how you think I’m dodging your question. I listed accuracy as being a part of arm talent. 
 

I’ll be shocked if the going into the 2022 offseason the Eagles are not looking to upgrade QB1. 

21 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Waddle is the better pro prospect than Smith.  Flame away.  

Agree 💯. That said Smith should be fantastic.

32 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Waddle is the better pro prospect than Smith.  Flame away.  

I agree but I also feel like Smith has less bust potential. 

23 minutes ago, eaglesflyers#1 said:

So since everyone is already writing Hurts off who would be worth trading for or trading up to #1 for in the draft?

You’re not trading up to #1 — that hasn’t brought a SB QB in how long?

You draft the correct QB at #10 or 12 like Mahomes or Watson, and let the Browns and Jets of the world draft Baker Mayfield and Sam Darnold at the top of the draft 

I like how everyone hated Sirianni from the first 30 seconds of his press conference. Then we finally hear from Gannon, he says he doesnt even have a defensive system, and he gets rave reviews after his PC.

Imagine what would be said if Sirianni said he had no system. People would have freaked the F out. 

57 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

Waddle is the better pro prospect than Smith.  Flame away.  

Probably.

I think so.  Most scouts thought so before the 2020 season.  And I have a feeling most teams thought so as well.  

After all, we did get an extra first round pick to take Smith instead of Waddle.  Teams don’t usually give those away.

Not taking anything from Smith who was the better player in college and still could be in the NFL.

17 minutes ago, HazletonEagle said:

I like how everyone hated Sirianni from the first 30 seconds of his press conference. Then we finally hear from Gannon, he says he doesnt even have a defensive system, and he gets rave reviews after his PC.

Imagine what would be said if Sirianni said he had no system. People would have freaked the F out. 

This word gets thrown about WAY too much by WAY too many people.  

45 minutes ago, EaglePhan1986 said:

Accuracy is huge. He doesn’t have it. Not yet anyway. I only needed one trait to breakdown. I don’t get how you think I’m dodging your question. I listed accuracy as being a part of arm talent. 
 

I’ll be shocked if the going into the 2022 offseason the Eagles are not looking to upgrade QB1. 

 

Then why not say accuracy instead of arm talent?  Because everything else that you listed that you qualify as arm talent you can't state why Hurts is insufficient at?  

13 minutes ago, 4for4EaglesNest said:

I don’t 

The question is Waddle or Smith & a ‘22 1st. Smith is good enough for me to prefer the latter

Re Siriani:

Belichick may have a quiet, smug, arrogance in PC's now, but he was terrible in front of a mic early on.  So was AR.  Chip was great.  That's not to say you avoid orators and pursue bumbling idiots, but it shows you how little it means.

Now, when Siriani, relentlessly and with childlike enthusiasm, hammers home the same cliches about loving ball, competing, and fundamentals, does it make me worry that the lights are on and nobody's home except a control chip hard-wired to Lowie's office?  Yep.  

But there's no point in passing judgement on that front until a season has passed.  

14 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said:

This word gets thrown about WAY too much by WAY too many people.  

I meant more than everyone. And I think youre exaggerating. 

1 minute ago, HazletonEagle said:

I meant more than everyone. And I think youre exaggerating. 

No, I'm not.  That word is used far far too frequently.   'Everyone' never agrees with anything said in here.    And I do mean 'never'.  There is always someone who disagrees with anything. 

Re Hurts:

I genuinely hope he's the next big thing and RTK makes us eat crow for the next decade as we follow suit in ordering our #1 Hurts authentic jerseys.  

Every fiber of my fandom and wasted time as arm-chair GM despises short, raw, run first QB's.  Just not the way to build an offense in the NFL.  My fear with Hurts is that he ascends to "pretty good" and then sticks, leaving us with the purgatory of a long-term commitment to a pretty good QB and wild-card playoff losses.  So while I (believe it or not) don't care if I'm wrong and won't be rooting against him, I won't be rooting for pretty good either.  In that case, we would be better off if he flames out.

Such is life as a non-first round QB.  You have a very tight window of opportunity to prove that you are something special.