MF POON Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said: apples... oranges... As for the bolded... nope. Reading comprehension helps. Wentz had his problems. As did Doug. As does Howie. The issue is that Wentz and Doug are in the past tense, but Howie remains present tense. The biggest issue with this team right now, is that the architect of everything organizationally, the one who is supposed to be in charge of the coaching staff decisions, the personnel decisions, the salary cap, the trades... all of it, is the one that shifts the blame to everyone but himself. Anyone that can't see that as the biggest issue of the team right now just doesn't want to acknowledge reality for whatever reason. The team is not in its current predicament because of Wentz. It is not in its current predicament because of Doug. The team is in its current predicament because Howie failed... and hasn't been held accountable. Wentz had his share, and is gone. No longer relevant. Doug had his share, and is gone. No longer relevant. Howie built it all, and is still here with the lack of talent, the pile of bad contracts, the complete and total lack of salary cap space for both this year and next (Already over $35M dead for 2022... and its going to get worse, not better... unless he decides to kick some of that can down the road again, just as he kicked the bad contracts of Alshon Jeffery and Malik Jackson to 2022, rather than deal with it in 2021.). I'll give you cred for saying everyone was to blame for the state of the team, I don't necessarily disagree with that argument. My issue was with you making an excuse for Wentz by listing the WR's he had, and stating he didn't have much help. He still stunk things up here for 2 seasons in a row, and his apparent flaws weren't attributed to bad receivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOTW Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 I heard Carson Wentz doesn't stack plates for the server to take away at a restaurant after he's done eating. Rude! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ipiggles Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 hour ago, EazyEaglez said: If you don’t care then why are you whining about Wentz? Really you never had to post anything. Feel free to go kiss Carson’s bottom someplace else. I love how all you have is insults. You are certainly not an objective fan, in fact, quite the opposite, you seem bitter and seem to be crying like a little child. LOL We are done here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles_Phan Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 48 minutes ago, MF POON said: I'll give you cred for saying everyone was to blame for the state of the team, I don't necessarily disagree with that argument. My issue was with you making an excuse for Wentz by listing the WR's he had, and stating he didn't have much help. He still stunk things up here for 2 seasons in a row, and his apparent flaws weren't attributed to bad receivers. I didn't make an excuse. I found it funny that you said he had talent around him and listed JJAW, Hightower and Reagor. As of right now, none of them would qualify as 'talent' by any measure, including being the leading receiver on this awful team. You ignored the most productive WRs and went with a list of (as of right now) players that have to improve to be raised to JAG level. You want to beat up Wentz... do it. Knock yourself out, but don't try to build a case that JJAW, et al. are 'talented'. That's disingenuous. Build your case on firmer ground. I didn't argue your conclusion. I argued your support for your conclusion. Wentz had his struggles. His struggles were exacerbated by these WRs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MF POON Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said: I didn't make an excuse. I found it funny that you said he had talent around him and listed JJAW, Hightower and Reagor. As of right now, none of them would qualify as 'talent' by any measure, including being the leading receiver on this awful team. You ignored the most productive WRs and went with a list of (as of right now) players that have to improve to be raised to JAG level. You want to beat up Wentz... do it. Knock yourself out, but don't try to build a case that JJAW, et al. are 'talented'. That's disingenuous. Build your case on firmer ground. I didn't argue your conclusion. I argued your support for your conclusion. Wentz had his struggles. His struggles were exacerbated by these WRs. I never said he had big talent - I said the WR's shouldn't be an excuse for why he failed. My whole point of bringing up McNabb was that he had awful receivers too, and still managed to have continued success here. Again, the bolded part is where we disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 51 minutes ago, Ipiggles said: I love how all you have is insults. You are certainly not an objective fan, in fact, quite the opposite, you seem bitter and seem to be crying like a little child. LOL We are done here. We are done. See your way out. If all you want to do is defend Wentz then we really don’t have anything else to discuss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggs Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Isn’t this a thread about the Carson Wentz pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 35 minutes ago, MF POON said: I never said he had big talent - I said the WR's shouldn't be an excuse for why he failed. My whole point of bringing up McNabb was that he had awful receivers too, and still managed to have continued success here. Again, the bolded part is where we disagree. Bad WRs didn’t make Wentz hold onto the ball too long and take bad sacks. They also didn’t make him throw into triple coverage or take horrible sack fumble against Dallas. Hey if Carson needs more receivers maybe he shouldn’t have set Ertz up to take that brutal hit. McNabb was going to NFC championship games with James Thrash as his one. The excuses these clowns make for this guy is ridiculous. They’re crying over and defending a guy who turned his back on them. 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggs Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Hey guys, did anyone mention that it’s being reported that Wentz will be the starter on Sunday? https://coltswire.usatoday.com/2021/09/08/nfl-colts-carson-wentz-to-play-seahawks-week-1/ Eye on the ball please.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles_Phan Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 39 minutes ago, MF POON said: I never said he had big talent - I said the WR's shouldn't be an excuse for why he failed. My whole point of bringing up McNabb was that he had awful receivers too, and still managed to have continued success here. Again, the bolded part is where we disagree. Pinkston, Thrash and Mitchell were all far more productive individually than JJAW, Hightower and Reagor collectively. The funniest part was you chose to highlight the worst receivers he had available to claim there was talent around him. But hey... build whatever case you wish to tear him down. I didn't say it was an excuse, I said its a bad argument to use. This team's WR corps has been (arguably) the worst in the NFL over the last 2 seasons. Greg Ward has become the most productive WR. He's a guy that would have a hard time making the roster for another team, let alone get playing time, let alone be the '#1' WR. And even so, you ignored him in your attack at Wentz, and pointed to JJAW, a guy with a career total of 10 receptions, and his only TD was on a fumble recovery. Hysterical stuff. You have plenty of things to build a case on against Wentz, if that's your goal. But, including the WR talent around him sure isn't one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MF POON Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said: Pinkston, Thrash and Mitchell were all far more productive individually than JJAW, Hightower and Reagor collectively. The funniest part was you chose to highlight the worst receivers he had available to claim there was talent around him. 😂 I think you need to go back and look at Pinky, Trash, and The people's champ stats. I also never listed Wentz's wr's, they were already listed by someone else. I wouldn't even bring up JJ or HIghtower, because Agholor and Alshon were the starting WR's here. Reagor, Agholor, Jordan Matthews, Fulgham, etc. as starters, are either on par, or slightly better than McNabb's trio. In saying that, none of them (minus Alshon) were ever considered "great" at any one point, so I'm not saying Wentz was surrounded by elite talent at the WR position. He did have weapons elsewhere though (like TE/RB, similar to McNabb). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles_Phan Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 14 minutes ago, MF POON said: 😂 I think you need to go back and look at Pinky, Trash, and The people's champ stats. I also never listed Wentz's wr's, they were already listed by someone else. I wouldn't even bring up JJ or HIghtower, because Agholor and Alshon were the starting WR's here. Reagor, Agholor, Jordan Matthews, Fulgham, etc. as starters, are either on par, or slightly better than McNabb's trio. In saying that, none of them (minus Alshon) were ever considered "great" at any one point, so I'm not saying Wentz was surrounded by elite talent at the WR position. He did have weapons elsewhere though (like TE/RB, similar to McNabb). New names... And moving goal posts. Wentz regressed. When he had Matthews in 2016, he wasn't 'bad'. Nor was he 'bad' in 2017 or even 2018 with Agholor. Wentz struggled in 2019 with no Wrs around him... to the point that they had to bring up Greg Ward, try out Deontay Burnett and Robert Davis. Those were the starters at the end of 2019. 2019 was the season that Agholor became a punchline. Then came the meltdown in 2020 that we all saw. WRs: Desean Jackson for a game. Alshon Jeffery on one leg. Greg Ward, waiver wire pickup Travis Fulgham, failed pick JJAW, disappointing rookie Reagor and dropsy John Hightower. Wentz wasn't the problem or the target for all this vitriol until 2020... and that was the receiving corps. Not Matthews, before he tried to become a TE; not Agholor, who played in Oakland. Don't move the goal posts. 2020 Wentz, which is where all the hate really started had scrap heap and garbage 'weapons', behind an OL that couldn't block without adjusting their gloves in the middle of a play. Hate on... but don't change the timeline, or the discussion without being called out on it. Like I said... apples and oranges. McNabb never had a season with an OL like the Eagles did this past year, nor a defense as pathetic, nor the complete and total shambles of WRs as the past two... not even the days of Charles Johnson and Torrence Small. 2020 was a culmination of a laundry list of bad... it was organization wide. Everyone played a part, but to claim Wentz was surrounded by all this talent last year is laughable and a down right lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 59 minutes ago, eggs said: Hey guys, did anyone mention that it’s being reported that Wentz will be the starter on Sunday? https://coltswire.usatoday.com/2021/09/08/nfl-colts-carson-wentz-to-play-seahawks-week-1/ Eye on the ball please.. Good news for the pick. I certainly hope he can play in enough games for that first, and play the Eagles into getting a high first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 Funny people whine about Wentz not having this or that, because those same people are trashing Hurts for playing with the same players Wentz was given. Sorry but you can’t cry and moan about a veteran playing and looking like hot garbage by blaming everyone BUT THAT PLAYER, but in the next moment criticize a rookie in the same situation. Your pathetic bias is showing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 41 minutes ago, MF POON said: 😂 I think you need to go back and look at Pinky, Trash, and The people's champ stats. I also never listed Wentz's wr's, they were already listed by someone else. I wouldn't even bring up JJ or HIghtower, because Agholor and Alshon were the starting WR's here. Reagor, Agholor, Jordan Matthews, Fulgham, etc. as starters, are either on par, or slightly better than McNabb's trio. In saying that, none of them (minus Alshon) were ever considered "great" at any one point, so I'm not saying Wentz was surrounded by elite talent at the WR position. He did have weapons elsewhere though (like TE/RB, similar to McNabb). Perhaps we show the video where Pickston refused to stretch out his hands, because he was scared to get hit. Yeah that’s what McNabb had to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles_Phan Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, EazyEaglez said: Funny people whine about Wentz not having this or that, because those same people are trashing Hurts for playing with the same players Wentz was given. Sorry but you can’t cry and moan about a veteran playing and looking like hot garbage by blaming everyone BUT THAT PLAYER, but in the next moment criticize a rookie in the same situation. Your pathetic bias is showing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MF POON Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 17 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said: New names... And moving goal posts. Wentz regressed. When he had Matthews in 2016, he wasn't 'bad'. Nor was he 'bad' in 2017 or even 2018 with Agholor. Wentz struggled in 2019 with no Wrs around him... to the point that they had to bring up Greg Ward, try out Deontay Burnett and Robert Davis. Those were the starters at the end of 2019. 2019 was the season that Agholor became a punchline. Then came the meltdown in 2020 that we all saw. WRs: Desean Jackson for a game. Alshon Jeffery on one leg. Greg Ward, waiver wire pickup Travis Fulgham, failed pick JJAW, disappointing rookie Reagor and dropsy John Hightower. Wentz wasn't the problem or the target for all this vitriol until 2020... and that was the receiving corps. Not Matthews, before he tried to become a TE; not Agholor, who played in Oakland. Don't move the goal posts. 2020 Wentz, which is where all the hate really started had scrap heap and garbage 'weapons', behind an OL that couldn't block without adjusting their gloves in the middle of a play. Hate on... but don't change the timeline, or the discussion without being called out on it. Like I said... apples and oranges. McNabb never had a season with an OL like the Eagles did this past year, nor a defense as pathetic, nor the complete and total shambles of WRs as the past two... not even the days of Charles Johnson and Torrence Small. 2020 was a culmination of a laundry list of bad... it was organization wide. Everyone played a part, but to claim Wentz was surrounded by all this talent last year is laughable and a down right lie. Something's wrong with you. I've repeatedly said Wentz has had bad WR's while here, but that's not the reason why he sucks. Keep arguing how bad those WR's actually are - I really don't care, but they're still not why Carson Wentz regressed and sucked the past 2 seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eglz1 Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 7 hours ago, Ipiggles said: The above timeline .... LOL'ing no where did I take issue with Foles. This is an example of why not to argue on the internet. It's a no win scenario. People are who they are, you wanna hate irrationally, go ahead. I choose to live a life less filled with bitterness. Good for you. That's not the Philly way, at least for some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EazyEaglez Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 48 minutes ago, MF POON said: 😂 I think you need to go back and look at Pinky, Trash, and The people's champ stats. I also never listed Wentz's wr's, they were already listed by someone else. I wouldn't even bring up JJ or HIghtower, because Agholor and Alshon were the starting WR's here. Reagor, Agholor, Jordan Matthews, Fulgham, etc. as starters, are either on par, or slightly better than McNabb's trio. In saying that, none of them (minus Alshon) were ever considered "great" at any one point, so I'm not saying Wentz was surrounded by elite talent at the WR position. He did have weapons elsewhere though (like TE/RB, similar to McNabb). Funny in 2018 and 19 the Wentz whiners were saying the same stuff about how bad his receivers were disregarding the fact most of those guys were sporting SB rings and winning playoff games without him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ipiggles Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, MF POON said: Something's wrong with you. I've repeatedly said Wentz has had bad WR's while here, but that's not the reason why he sucks. Keep arguing how bad those WR's actually are - I really don't care, but they're still not why Carson Wentz regressed and sucked the past 2 seasons. OK so is your argument is that he should have been able to play lights out behind a decimated Oline and throwing to less than practice squad recievers? Cause I mean I guess we can all point to QB's who have had that situation and still played really well? Or maybe not. huh? Curious to what you wish to say is why Wentz regressed? Head injury? Or just that he was never that good to begin with? Or something else? 25 minutes ago, Iggles_Phan said: New names... And moving goal posts. Wentz regressed. When he had Matthews in 2016, he wasn't 'bad'. Nor was he 'bad' in 2017 or even 2018 with Agholor. Wentz struggled in 2019 with no Wrs around him... to the point that they had to bring up Greg Ward, try out Deontay Burnett and Robert Davis. Those were the starters at the end of 2019. 2019 was the season that Agholor became a punchline. Then came the meltdown in 2020 that we all saw. WRs: Desean Jackson for a game. Alshon Jeffery on one leg. Greg Ward, waiver wire pickup Travis Fulgham, failed pick JJAW, disappointing rookie Reagor and dropsy John Hightower. Wentz wasn't the problem or the target for all this vitriol until 2020... and that was the receiving corps. Not Matthews, before he tried to become a TE; not Agholor, who played in Oakland. Don't move the goal posts. 2020 Wentz, which is where all the hate really started had scrap heap and garbage 'weapons', behind an OL that couldn't block without adjusting their gloves in the middle of a play. Hate on... but don't change the timeline, or the discussion without being called out on it. Like I said... apples and oranges. McNabb never had a season with an OL like the Eagles did this past year, nor a defense as pathetic, nor the complete and total shambles of WRs as the past two... not even the days of Charles Johnson and Torrence Small. 2020 was a culmination of a laundry list of bad... it was organization wide. Everyone played a part, but to claim Wentz was surrounded by all this talent last year is laughable and a down right lie. Just an FYI they tell you never to argue on the internet, and you know why right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles_Phan Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Ipiggles said: Just an FYI they tell you never to argue on the internet, and you know why right? I do. But, I had a bit of time on my hands... figured I'd waste it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MF POON Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Ipiggles said: OK so is your argument is that he should have been able to play lights out behind a decimated Oline and throwing to less than practice squad recievers? Cause I mean I guess we can all point to QB's who have had that situation and still played really well? Or maybe not. huh? Curious to what you wish to say is why Wentz regressed? Head injury? Or just that he was never that good to begin with? Or something else? Just an FYI they tell you never to argue on the internet, and you know why right? No, I never expected him to play lights out (like he did in 2017), but I also didn't expect him to be essentially dead last in the league statistically either. With him being considered "the greatest Eagles QB in history" by some, I figured he could be at least middle of the pack. I don't know, maybe he was never really that good, or Foles having success got in his head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ipiggles Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, MF POON said: No, I never expected him to play lights out (like he did in 2017), but I also didn't expect him to be essentially dead last in the league statistically either. With him being considered "the greatest Eagles QB in history" by some, I figured he could be at least middle of the pack. I don't know, maybe he was never really that good, or Foles having success got in his head. Or it's a team game, and when you lose confidence in : your oline, WR's and Coaches? Maybe just maybe you will be tentative and make poor decisions. As oppossed to having confidence the line will protect you, the WR's will be where they are suppossed to be and the HC wont sub in old oft injured players ahead of younger guys who were playing better with you, you probably will play better as a result? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MF POON Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, Ipiggles said: Or it's a team game, and when you lose confidence in : your oline, WR's and Coaches? Maybe just maybe you will be tentative and make poor decisions. As oppossed to having confidence the line will protect you, the WR's will be where they are suppossed to be and the HC wont sub in old oft injured players ahead of younger guys who were playing better with you, you probably will play better as a result? all excuses for why it's not his fault I see. 😄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK_EaglesFan89 Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 25 minutes ago, MF POON said: all excuses for why it's not his fault I see. 😄 That'll always be the way with Carson unfortunately. Never his fault just a ton of excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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